-
riceandbeans
So, if a pool doesn't get kickbacks, then how does a pool operate to get more money? What's the incentive to run the pool?
-
moneromooo
They typically keep a slice of the block rewards.
-
riceandbeans
Isn't that a pool fee?
-
moneromooo
It is indeed called a pool fee.
-
riceandbeans
-
riceandbeans
Hence the fee in that chart
-
riceandbeans
I guess
-
moneromooo
FWIW that site is owned by a squatter/blackmailer. Careful about what you find there.
-
moneromooo
(though no outright malware was ever found on it AFAIK)
-
riceandbeans
I don't fear malware. I'm running DragonFly BSD and using Firefox. Most shit won't run on my rig anyway lol
-
riceandbeans
I can't even get software I want to run here, let alone malware
-
dsc_
No malware - but outdated Monero versions :/
-
riceandbeans
Anyway, couldn't someone in the monero project complain to like icann or something to get the domain?
-
riceandbeans
I mean they hand it over to people for malicious crap
-
moneromooo
They apparently could. Probability of success unclear.
-
bigslim[m]
Thanks for all your contributions monero team
-
Inge-
hah. Saylor "maybe you need a monero"
-
marmulak
gib monero
-
nakedpony
imagine investing in a utility coin xD xD xD
-
marmulak
explain
-
marmulak
we're supposed to use subaddresses, right?
-
Inge-
marmulak: subaddress good.
-
artefact
i also mine xmr on my cpu. might as well get a (pitiful) amount of money back for heating my room in the cold months
-
marmulak
Inge-: thanks, it was easy enough to figure out
-
marmulak
and the subaddresses are for receiving, so I take it with monero the recipient doesn't know the sender's address, right
-
Inge-
well the recipient NEVER knows the senders address, so that isn't an issue
-
Inge-
but I can give you one subaddress and somebody else another subaddress -
-
Inge-
instead of handing out the same address everywhere. this makes it much harder to correlate activity to me
-
marmulak
indeed
-
marmulak
I remember something about how on bitcoin-like cryptos if you use a lot of subaddresses (more than 100?) you need to keep your wallet backed up because the seed may not be enough information to get them all back? Or is the seed enough to find them all again
-
Inge-
for Monero the seed is all you need
-
algo_max[m]
With monero the seed is enough, if you had 10 sub-addresses and you restore your wallet from the seed, then create 10 sub-addresses again, they will be the same.
-
Inge-
it is good for a few billion subaddresses ...
-
Inge-
per account
-
Inge-
and a few billion accounts
-
fullmetalScience
Hi. What's meant by "unlock times are now deterministic" for the network upgrade?
-
Inge-
isn't that the older change - that the 10-block unlock time for outputs is now enforced by the protocol?
-
marmulak
btw can I have cryptonote flair in matrix
-
d4ndo[m]
It seems that more transactions are made on weekdays than on weekends.
postimg.cc/64dTPYkJ
-
d4ndo[m]
Mo Di Mi Do Fr Sa So
-
d4ndo[m]
7125 7084 7128 7223 6777 6191 5947
-
d4ndo[m]
And on Thursday most people order their cannabis for the weekend.
-
d4ndo[m]
I did this with monero-blockchain-stats and a small Gnu R script.
-
d4ndo[m]
Oh sorry the weekday is in german.
-
charolastra
guess they use it up on the WE and then have to restock on mondays
-
d4ndo[m]
So if you want to be as inconspicuous as possible, then Monday or Thursday is best. XD
-
ErCiccione[H]
test
-
dEBRUYNE
Inge-: Yes, this was already added last network upgrade
-
alexanarcho[m]
having an issue with starting the stagenet monerod... getting the following error E Exception in main! locale::facet::_S_create_c_locale name not valid
-
alexanarcho[m]
my locale is all english and before the update to 17.1. it was working fine...
-
marmulak
o rly
-
alexanarcho[m]
i cannot start monerod at all wether with stagenet flag or not
-
alexanarcho[m]
17.0.0 has the same issue
-
alexanarcho[m]
16.0.3 is working though... this is super strange
-
alexanarcho[m]
(i use arch btw)
-
p3rL
.pap sushi
-
fluffypony
alexanarcho[m]: known issue
-
fluffypony
do this
-
fluffypony
LANG=C LC_ALL=C ./monerod
-
fluffypony
moneromooo: ^^
-
alexanarcho[m]
thanks!
-
fluffypony
definitely a regression in 0.17
-
raecarruth
ohai fellas :)
-
alexanarcho[m]
perfect, now it works, is this a one time command or should i always start the monerod like this?
-
fluffypony
you'll always have to until this is fixed
-
alexanarcho[m]
no problem, just added it to my bash alias
-
dEBRUYNE
alexanarcho[m]: Would you mind creating a brief Monero SE guide for it?
-
dEBRUYNE
Then we can easily link to that in case anyone else asks
-
alexanarcho[m]
<dEBRUYNE "alexanarcho: Would you mind crea"> whats monero SE?
-
fluffypony
stack exchange
-
alexanarcho[m]
yep
-
dEBRUYNE
-
dEBRUYNE
^ That yes
-
dEBRUYNE
You can open a new question and answer it
-
dEBRUYNE
Not necessarily for someone else to provide an answer
-
dEBRUYNE
Not necessary*
-
alexanarcho[m]
-
dEBRUYNE
Looks good, thanks
-
alexanarcho[m]
glad i could be of help
-
moneromooo
alexanarcho[m]: I need a stack trace for where this happens. There's a startup check to sanitize LANG/LC_ALL, but it looks like it doesn't catch everything.
-
moneromooo
(ie, see what call from monero ends up causing this)
-
moneromooo
The trace will be in the log file, on log level 0. You need libunwind comiled in.
-
fullmetalScience
-
dEBRUYNE
That's different
-
dEBRUYNE
Previous HF ensured minimum unlock time of 10 blocks was enforced
-
dEBRUYNE
That commit makes the unlock_time variable deterministic
-
d4ndo[m]
Ok- Here are the distribution of transactions 2020
postimg.cc/jWySTNyQ
-
d4ndo[m]
And weekdays for 2020
postimg.cc/nXjLdNzW
-
Inge-
pretty boring distribution :D
-
copenhagen_bram[
If atomic swaps are eventually possible between Monero and Bitcoin, will they be used with xmr.to?
-
binaryFate
what advantage/drawback would you see?
-
Inge-
ooof
-
yanmaani
binaryFate: users can be sure you don't take the money and split
-
yanmaani
(or that there's no software bug where the money just vanishes into smoke)
-
binaryFate
yeah that's the only advantage. But for an established incorporated business running since 5.5 years this fear does not seem to bother much people
-
yanmaani
will be interesting to see if atomic swaps has a material impact on the market. If you can do them, then XMR <-> XBT's decentralized liquidity will be much better.
-
binaryFate
downside is terribly slow processing, you need 2 transactions to take place on each chain (BTC blocks are 10mn).
-
alexanarcho[m]
yeah, but i imagine a lot of shady people will try to wash their tainted bitcoins that way
-
yanmaani
alexanarcho[m]: right, you'll have a lot of extremely tainted coins
-
binaryFate
you would still have to place significant trust in xmrto not to give you terribly dirty BTC.
-
yanmaani
But like, will we see bisq-esque services for XBTXMR atomic swaps?
-
binaryFate
so you remove the trust about "running away with the funds", but the trust about "don't send me terrible BTC" remains.
-
yanmaani
binaryFate: Since you can see on-chain it was atomic swapped, I'll guess the Chainalysis catamites will mark it tainted as all hell
-
kayabaNerve
I don't know why xmr.to would move to atomic swaps, especially given their role as a website and not an app
-
kayabaNerve
Atomic swaps enable secure, decentralized trading. They're the perfect way to exchange one crypto for another.
-
kayabaNerve
Though yes, latency.
-
yanmaani
the latency also means the price is worse
-
kayabaNerve
So Bisq uses a multisig, and because of that, has an extensive/poor arbitration service. Atomic swaps don't have that at all
-
yanmaani
so there may be a pecuniary advantage to xmr.to
-
yanmaani
Bisq is a total joke
-
kayabaNerve
That said, humorously, the atomic swap protocol is based off multisigs (sort of)
-
yanmaani
tried to use it, it was awful
-
kayabaNerve
Yep
-
binaryFate
I hope there will be all sort of markets. (I'm super curious where the price ends up or how a market can form when nobody vets for the BTC). But for something that is all about convenience when you want to make a purchase (xmrto case), I don't see the benefit at all
-
raecarruth
openbazaar is better than bisq
-
yanmaani
I don't think XBT will lose fungibility. You'll always be able to wash funds through miners.
-
raecarruth
but they kinda shit the bed
-
alexanarcho[m]
the main benefit i see for atomic swaps is that it makes it really hard to ban monero if you allow bitcoin.
-
yanmaani
binaryFate: As long as the wallet doesn't integrate support for atomic swaps :)
-
moneromooo
It'll probably be used mostly for infrequent large transfers, where the cost of conveninence is small compared to that of a scam.
-
kayabaNerve
A LTC/XMR swap would only take five minutes, just as a heads up
-
yanmaani
big transactions will cost a lot of money tho. Better to take small increments through xmr.to and friends
-
kayabaNerve
Or 2 minutes for a ETH/XMR
-
moneromooo
Maybe those mythical institutional investors, where falling for a scam might also open them up to legal challenge for lack of due diligence.
-
kayabaNerve
Limiting factor on the latter is XMR
-
binaryFate
Still in the best case you need 2 intertwined txs on each chain. That's 30mn on average provided the other party does not fall through at some point. Even integrated in a wallet, that's not the same convenience at all.
-
yanmaani
kayabaNerve: Couldn't you use something insane like LN or something?
-
yanmaani
I'm quite shocked there's no PoS sidechains for Bitcoin tbh. You could get PoS that isn't a scam with all the nice confirmations times etc that entails.
-
yanmaani
[inb4 I get banned from #monero for "shilling altcoins"]
-
kayabaNerve
yanmaani: I think? Yet you still need a XMR block
-
kayabaNerve
Unless you get 0-conf
-
yanmaani
are there any nice l2 solutions for monero?
-
moneromooo
No.
-
kayabaNerve
I mean, XMR 0-conf is better than BTC, but it's still unsafe and shouldn't be used
-
kayabaNerve
No Layer Two, but Layer Moo coming soon? :P
-
yanmaani
binaryFate: If it's for online shopping, you might be OK with the wait, especially if the wallet does the hassle for you.
-
binaryFate
why zero-conf should not be used on Monero? Everyone is free to run their own risk-assessment depending on amounts
-
binaryFate
xmrto accepts zeroconf for significant amounts, since years
-
binaryFate
minko too. (Happy hour in 2.5h btw :)
-
dsc_
Have not properly read the atomic swaps proposal but which wallet is going to implement it - if at all ? :-)
-
yanmaani
I had a crazy idea like that. If tx1 is posted to the chain, and a double-spend of tx1 is posted in that block or in the next N blocks, X% gets sent to miners as reward and (100-X)% is burned
-
yanmaani
If X = 0, that would go a long way towards making 0conf secure, since miners would still have incentive to include both because of the tx fees
-
kayabaNerve
I'm trying to shill this one guy named dsc_ on getting it into feather :P
-
moneromooo
You'd need to have amounts in the clear.
-
kayabaNerve
binaryFate: Sure, you can use it if you install trust. Why would you install trust though? :P
-
dsc_
kayabaNerve: does it come as a library we link against?
-
kayabaNerve
sort of?
-
kayabaNerve
If you write the C FFI binding
-
dsc_
or separate bin?
-
kayabaNerve
Either?
-
yanmaani
moneromooo: Not if you're burning it, surely? Alternately, couldn't you say something like "you can send the whole UTXO to this address with known privkey, and then you can burn X% in tx fee"?
-
dsc_
Ok lets talk about this in X time when its finished ^^
-
kayabaNerve
asmr has a main file, yet it's completely not necessary. That said, it does manage an Electrum RPC/monerod/monero-wallet-cli connection so...
-
yanmaani
kayabaNerve: atomic swap also needs trust
-
kayabaNerve
Oh. Proposal will be a lib. 100%
-
yanmaani
because there's still optionality
-
kayabaNerve
yanmaani: Whole point is it's trustless
-
kayabaNerve
I mean, yes, you 'trust' them to follow through, where if they don't, you waste the TX fees and your time
-
kayabaNerve
But all you do is trust them to not be an ass
-
kayabaNerve
dsc_: I was referring to the existing work :P Proposal will be an integrateable suite, 100%
-
yanmaani
I pledge to buy XMR at price X, I now have a free call option {S = X, T = 30m}
-
dsc_
kayabaNerve: cool cool
-
kayabaNerve
Sounds like trust over the order book, not the swap
-
yanmaani
K = X*
-
yanmaani
kayabaNerve: there still needs to be trust somewhere :)
-
moneromooo
yanmaani: I don't know. Moving an output altogether might work without amounts in the clear, but the "new owner" would need to know the blinding factor to reuse it I think. Crypto's not my domain though so I'm not sure.
-
kayabaNerve
You're trusting a few cents in TX fees that they won't back out, not to mention the opportunity cost on locking your funds for ten minutes, yes.
-
kayabaNerve
But that's it for the swap itself.
-
kayabaNerve
When you broadcast a TX to a node, you trust they'll move it forward.
-
yanmaani
moneromooo: no, the idea is you send it to a key that's already public
-
yanmaani
so the miner can spend it by ordering the transactions properly
-
yanmaani
but anyone can see what's happening, because they also have the privkey
-
yanmaani
oh, nvm, I see what you mean
-
yanmaani
yeah, OK. It's much simpler and more secure to burn it altogether then.
-
moneromooo
Clever.
-
binaryFate
Regardless whether technically possible, double spends happen a lot by mistake/bug/wallet crash... few of them I think are nefarious, would be very harsh on users to grab or burn their money
-
binaryFate
Personally I would never flush my pool again :)
-
MalMen
/4[0-9AB][123456789ABCDEFGHJKLMNPQRSTUVWXYZabcdefghijkmnopqrstuvwxyz]{93}/
-
MalMen
for the new addresses its only change the 4 to an 8 right ? or there is something else that I should account for ?
-
riceandbeans
kayabaNerve: I think the problem with eth/xmr would be that gas prices are obscene
-
riceandbeans
MalMen: what are you writing that regex for?
-
asy
MalMen: you could try decoding the address and checking the first byte, and then you can validate the checksum too
-
MalMen
-
MalMen
I want to check if an given string is a valid address or not
-
artefact
don't addresses have some kind of parity check?
-
moneromooo
A 32 bit checksum.
-
rotten
Minko happy hour kicking off in just one hour over at minko.to. Play and grow your Monero knowledge; trivia prizes will be very generous between 17:00 and 19:00 UTC.
-
moneromooo
Or 8 bit... not sure.
-
moneromooo
Looks like 8 bit.
-
asy
.t utc
-
xmrmatterbridge
<rbrunner7> Checksum for Monero addresses is 4 bytes. Can be seen and checked here:
xmr.llcoins.net/addresstests.html
-
xmrmatterbridge
<rbrunner7> One reason why they are so awfully long :)
-
mmxxx[m]
hello rotten :)
-
moneromooo
Odd. I see uint8_t get_account_address_checksum(const public_address_outer_blob& bl);
-
moneromooo
Not the same thing then ?
-
xmrmatterbridge
<rbrunner7> No idea. I just programmed those addresses inside out in that unspeakable entity's programming language recently and happened to remember.
-
xmrmatterbridge
<rbrunner7> That's interesting: The method you mention is called in '/src/cryptonote_basic/cryptonote_basic_impl.cpp in a section commented "// Old address format"
-
moneromooo
Ah, thanks.
-
xmrmatterbridge
<rbrunner7> Funny that there ever was another address format it seems ...
-
xmrmatterbridge
<rbrunner7> Maybe just simpler checksum, who knows
-
d4ndo[m]
Is there any evidence that this is actually being practised with tainted Bitcoin? In other words, an exchange withholds the Bitcoin. And what does the Bitcoin community say about such practices?
-
d4ndo[m]
They need to proove you stole the coins.
-
d4ndo[m]
Only the
-
d4ndo[m]
the trail is not enough proove, is it?
-
MalMen
Im curious about what Alex_LocalMonero made one localmonero by providing only addresses started with 4
-
MalMen
looks my address from localmoner is valid, with the checksum, but the field 15 give me another address
-
Alex_LocalMonero
@MalMen, you mean to ask why we provide integrated instead of subaddresses?
-
d4ndo[m]
Another chart - just for fun.
postimg.cc/BP2RFP1C
-
ndorf
hm, one of my nodes spams 'Setting timer on a shut down object' 10-20 times per minute. anyone know what's up with that?
-
MalMen
wo, Alex_LocalMonero I didnt knew that was integrated addresses xD when subaddresses ? :P
-
Inge-
d4ndo[m]: people have been wsrned by exchanges or had accounts closed, for their withdrawn crypto to lster have been sent to gambling or other "high risk" recipients
-
d4ndo[m]
ok
-
d4ndo[m]
But you still have access to your funds acording to coinbase website.
-
d4ndo[m]
shorturl.at/zCDG7
-
d4ndo[m]
In extremely rare circumstances, and only where required by law, Coinbase may block or "freeze" customer funds on our platform. ( to comply with an order from a court).
-
d4ndo[m]
It is not as bad as it might seem. At least for now.
-
Alex_LocalMonero
@MalMen, no current ETA.