nioc: perfect, thanks

meow

Zerock: make screenshot, put it online and i'll scan it in monerujo

oh yeah I guess that's an idea

I can just send a screenshot to myself and put it on my PC

right

good thinking :)

screenshots not allowed -_-

ohh, I think I figured it out

it prepends the address with "monero" but not "monero:"

oof

is the dev in this channel?

I see someone from the staff page but not the main dev's alias

i would open an issue at github.com/m2049r/xmrwallet/issues

it appears it's already been fixed :D

lol strike hopefully no one kicks the bot it was invited to be here :)

lol

but yeah bot can be restricted as needed

hell it can be auto disabled if channel is busy even

like if there's a lot of talking bot use can be prevented

I had a separate channel for heavy tippero usage. Just do the same.

yeah like i said yesterday people are free to use the bot to their heart's content in the bot channels. Like ##wallet & ##walletbot are both quite active

that's why i said if the bot needs to be restricted to be here it's possible

Cool. I don't think you mentioned those channels before. I certainly did not see it.

was in middle of the bot spam during the new toy phase :D

Fair enough :)

you know when new toy arrives & everyone feels need to over-do it lol

but yeah if you had a bot channel like #monero-bots or whatever I can redirect all output from the bot to that channel with a notice to use the bot there

that can be done for specific commands or during busy times etc

i try to cover all the bases for different communities

just like if the bot is in discord, telegram & freenode the channels can be bridged in the bot then WHAT passes the bridge can be set. like bot commands can be filtered to not be sent to the other side

so yeah before anyone boots the bot please get with me to see what can be worked out to keep everyone happy :)

Are the criticisms of privacy coins in this talk generally thought of as valid?

what are the criticisms youre referring to? im listening to it

finely:

well privacy concerns are valid but question is level of importance to any individual & why. some feel privacy doesn't need a reason. others think there are legit reasons to give up some privacy. then again figure there's some who figure it's no big deal wither way.

i mean billions of people sit on social media & give up their privacy willingly & nearly without limit

when you point it out to them they usually say "so what"

It's like being naked in the street. It doesn't harm you (assuming it's not too cold) but most people still don't do it, even if they're not harmed.

"do i care if the world knows i ate taco bell today & that my dog's name is Spot? Nope"

right and at same time those clothes could have your address written on them too

generally speaking i don't have much to hide from the world but i want to be the one to choose what gets let out

i think hes talking about concerns of the use of privacy coins

i havent heard what hes talking about yet in the video yet though

yeah i figured such

"Why are you wearing clothes in the street ? Do you have anything to hide ?"

but was making small talk on topic in meantime :)

yes my massive dong

wouldn't want your wife chasing me down

what criticism are you referring to?

finely

with a knife ?

lol why are you switching between irc & matrix :D

all ive heard so far is criticisms against public blockchains etc xD

wearing clothes doesnt mean you have something to hide but wearing clothes definitely makes it easier to hide something if you want

To show off my keyboard skillz. Or maybe because we're two different people. Or I've got dual personality disorder.

split personality of hte same person

/nick moneromoop

A third one ? Crikey.

<Fat and Proud (FAP)> test

if i sent 10 bitcoin i probably don't care if it's on public block chain. until i sent 10 bitcoin & someone pointed out the address was associated with something nefarious

ices FAP

the's the issue with privacy.. it doesn't matter until it does

so do you protect it no matter what or be lax & hope for the best

If only it were up to the person, it'd be fine.

But there's so much pressure from everywhere to give it up, obstacles everywhere, etc.

Some people just don't understand others might want to be left alone.

and none of this goes into evil doers either

F...ing busybodies...

just average joe's minding their own

brooo this dude drops a question and just dips

typical eh lol

we're having to carry the whole Fn conversation

did he actually leave matrix side?

idk xD so weird

<moneromoon[m] "what are the criticisms youre re"> Its been s while since I watched it, but if I remember correctly they are mostly statistical attack to deanonymise users. Made easier by the fact most users of privacy coins that have optional privacy don't use those features so the attacks are easier.

I did not watch, but statistical heuristics certainly do exist.

I think youre getting confused on his criticisms against non-privacy coins

that is why Monero / privacy coins are better. because its very easy to deanonymise users if they aare not using a private blockchain

No, these attacks were on XMR and Dash.

Bitcoin is extremely easy to deanonymize

the only time he mentions monero

is when hes talking about swapping Bitcoin for monero and immediately back to bitcoin

i watched the entire thing

the easy thing is tracking the bitcoin user regardless of the fact that he swapped for monero for a split moment

I'll have to watch again🙂

because he still uses a centralized exchange to do so

and Monero is working on "Atomic Swaps" which allows P2P native swaps without a centralized exchange

but if you swap Bitcoin for monero andd back to Bitcoin - But you use the same exact Bitcoin Address.. everyone knows what you did...

Interesting, thanks for the feedback.

<3

lol that wouldn't be very smart thing to do eh

re-use the same addresses after mixer :D

big brain

also using a wallet that has bitcoin it received only from a mixer...

very sus lol

yeah not much point in privacy if gonna half ass it

but i touched the privacy coin!

I touched it! i should be good right?

Watched it again. The taint tree attacks seem to be an inherent weakness of decoy based privacy coins like monero. Your right, two of the attacks rely on linking a parent address to a person through an exchange with KYC, but there are other ways an address could be deanonymised. And the tainted dust attack doesn't seem to require access to exchange data at all.

Are taint tree attacks considered statistical heuristics?

His central claim is repeated interaction with a sender or receiver breaks the anonymity of decoy based privacy coins.

your understanding it wrong

the taint tree is bitcoin

there is no tree you can follow in Monero

Monero has no tree

Bitcoin has a tree

magic privacy coin that doesn't work how you think right :D

by "you" i mean the imaginary you who thinks privacy is magical lol

the entire time hes talking about repeated interactions with a sender or receiver - hes talking about NON privacy coins

hes not talking about Monero

this 'decoy based privacy coin' you're referring to is just Bitcoin.......

moneromoon[m]: are you familiar with the eabe attack

Nope, he is definitely classifying Monero as a decoy based system. See the slide @ 9:10. All cryptonote/ringct coins, as well as older mixing techniques for bitcoin.

Not saying he's right, just interested in what mathematicians and computer scientists with a better understanding of graph theory than me think.

thats only a hypothetical attack thoughg

moonrays[m]: who are you responding to?

whoops

moneromoon[m]: ^^

nioc

yeah im pretty sure thats just outdated information if youve kept up with Moneros ddevelopment im not sure what exactly hes referring to on that slide

it's real enough that mitigations have and are being worked on

yep exactly

it will be made impossible

either way

so not hypothetical

and currently viable

i dont think thats what hes referring to tho lol

that being said it is for a particular set of circumstances

which you can avoid, but therefore it's not set it and forget it

ofc nothing is

certainly better than this.... pbs.twimg.com/media/EoNazPsXEAIe7VQ?format=jpg&name=small

by far

This looks like the text of the video:

you'd need to look into the actual security solutions of Monero

monero uses zero knowledge proofs also

ring signatures is not the only solution implemented

it's how the entire tx protocol is implemented

multiple layers of security

that's where this might just be outdated information..

not that there is zero proof involved

at this point it's probably easier to track zcash than monero because of implementation

<nioc "which you can avoid, but therefo"> Trying to wrap my head around the particular circumstances that would be bad. What mitigations are you talking about?

such as the choice for opt in privacy with zcash

<moneromoon[m] "it will be made impossible"> Not convinced that is true, he is describing a whole class of attacks. We gave no idea what other attacks like thus could be devised in the future.

eabe where e is an exchange that has knowledge/identity of 2 people/businesses (a,b) transacting

yeah but we dont know what kind of attacks on central banks could be devised in the future

you need to churn, that is do a couple of sends to self as an intermediate step

even if one layer of monero is compromised, there's 4 others...

fo

does not concern me

zcash is much more concerning than Monero

'opt-in' privacy weakens the entire networks privacy

Monero is private by default

and much depends on your needs

<nioc "monero uses zero knowledge proof"> Thanks. How do zero knowledge proofs relate to moneros privacy?

<moneromoon[m] "'opt-in' privacy weakens the ent"> Agreed, especially when the number of transactions is small.

what is a zero knowledge proof? doesn't mean that there is zero knowledge of everything that happens

a zero knowledge proof is not a tx protocol

it has become a buzz word'

this pry helps explain what happened back in 2018 2019 between zcash and monero

Didn't know monero had stopped using ring signatures.

i'm pretty sure its a combination of ring signatures + stealth addresses + ringCT

Reading the bulletproof+ preprint, it sounds like this is using a zero knowledge proof to avoid revealing the amount in a certain transaction.

sounds correct to me

Am I right in that a transaction must come from the subset of addresses in the ring signature?

you can see addresses in the ring signatures?

That was my understanding, but its been a long time since I learned about them.

Eabe attack is a replay/playback attack?

no you cannot see the address in the ring signature

that is the 'ringct' implementation

on top of not being able to see the address - even if you could see the address - its also using 'stealth address' implementation.

ring signatures + stealth addresses + ringCT + Bulletproof + Dandelion++

Layers. multiple layers of security on top of eachother.

"finely[m] sent a long message:" (how long was it. lol)

<TheLizardWizard4013> we thinking Elon will give Monero the stamp of approval?

<how> Not after bitcoin sadly

No thank you.

You elonsexuals are weird as fuck.

<TheLizardWizard4013> Listen. You don't have to like or dislike the man to acknowledge that he can hurt prices in short term

<mmxxx[m] "You elonsexuals are weird as fuc"> How do u know my kinds

Hey guys got a question about Kovri... what happened to it?

Why it’s not yet set as default into Monero?

<DisBotXMR "<TheLizardWizard4013> Listen. Yo"> He hasn't. You guys have a tendency to overstate his importance. He has been tweeting about doge for a couple of years. It was only when WSB got involved that the price boomed.

People have been predicting btc to 50k for YEARS

And even beyond 50k

<TheLizardWizard4013> who got WSB involved?

<TheLizardWizard4013> anyways. Maybe I wait until he says no due to the proposal sounding like a hostage letter to Elon

They got involved after they got shafted dealing with GME

<TheLizardWizard4013> and then buy some more

Hey guys got a question about Kovri... what happened to it?
Why it’s not yet set as default into Monero?

• Which options can users use to break the link between their Monero activity and their identity?

* Hey guys got a question about Kovri... what happened to it?
Why it’s not set as default into Monero?

• Which options can users use to break the link between their Monero activity and their identity?

Bonjour all

So what ports do I need to forward if I want to host a node?

I want to host one on my spare ubuntu machine

Hi ForestMapper Take a look at this guide: sethsimmons.me/guides/run-a-monero-node

Do y'all recommend using Veracrypt or Age to encrypt files?

angrymonkeyboi[m: i recommend to run full disk encryption. and if you have alot of coins to have dedicated computer just for that

That's a must, yes. But I want to backup to other computers

in case I drop coffee on mine or it gets stolen

Encrypt your other computers as well! In fact I have no unencrypted device because why should I?

If you want to double encrypt so that the backups are save even if your computer gets hacked I use gpg with symmetric encryption.

yes, of course

I want to throw my encrypted file up on multiple cloud providers. just to be extra sure it's not going to disappear

yeah then I would use gpg. I use "gpg --output backup_file.tar.zst.gpg --symmetric backup_file.tar.zst"

I have been doing research on this, and multiple people have recommended not using gpg as it has many outdated defaults, and is difficult to configure correctly

Oh ok well I didn't really dive into it. May be right.

mostly people on /r/crypto

angrymonkeyboi this should be a decent config ^

Ahh. I'm interested in symmetric encryption

I'm currently leaning towards age, as it's pretty slick

The "default preference list" line affects symmetric encryption as well, by prioritizing AES256

You can look at the bettercrypto.org link if you want to see a full explanation of each line

I think there were a couple more things about gpg that weren't very good that I don't currently recall (besides default algo)

i'll see if I can find the thread on reddit

But it seems like the prevailing recommendation is to either use veracrypt or age

github.com/FiloSottile/age seems hella slick, but it's kinda new

Lots of people complaining about gpg, mostly because they completely miss the point of it

Gpg has the ultimate flexibility, in exchange for some complexity

what's wrong with prioritizing AES256?

is there any reason that monero seems to be more stable than many other high-profile cryptocurrencies at the moment?

it might just be an inexplicable coincidence

but the relative stability sure is nice for its usability

Possibly because a number of cryptos are just fork with shit added on top and no work stabilising the code afterwards.

We attract less edgy meme lords so no 🚀🚀🚀🚀

Takes to to iron out all the bugs.

*Takes time

And even then, monero isn't immune by any means.

monero is only stable against fiat. while fiat is in a inflationary collapse ...

<fluffydonkey[m] "We attract less edgy meme lords "> i guess that's a fair assessment :P

anybody here

ningli[m], on the wallet you can choose restore height

try setting it to 0

maybe you´re not scanning the whole blockcahin

or the correct one

alright

also which blockchain explorer you are using ?

i use the mymonero wallet

the online one ?

there was a scammy one if I recall correctly

does the tx show confirmation on xmrchain.net ?

at the begining,i used the monerujo to receive funds,but i cant received it,so i use other wallet to recovery the address from seed,but i cant see my funds in any wallet,that's all about it

Did you create the wallet on mymonero, or create it elsewhere then import it ?

truth

yes, i just input my address and view-key, and i really saw this transaction

i create on monerujo

a light-wallet on Droid

erm

I do not compute

ningli[m]: do you have the transaction hash for the incoming funds?

yes

ef7f913086f7c66c0a60badf5a91fb2009e88cc02758ebc657c4ff8cc51b34a8

you can put it into xmrchain.net then along with your wallet addr and private viewkey (note: you are disclosing that to a third party)

and it can tell you whether or not your viewkey 'owns' any of the outputs in the transaction

yes

i have seen the tx in that way

but once i use the wallet-app,there is no record and funds...

ningli[m]: did you know that if you share your transaction hashes, IRC automatically replaces them with stars? look: ****************************************************************

just trolling

oh

i dont know

it's a joke

it's my first time to use this website

ningli[m]: as for the transaction maybe you saw the transaction like that but you have to see if your viewkey owns the output(s)

ningli[m], try on monerujo use a remote node and set restore height 2301564

alright,i'm laughing

ningli[m]: +1

hold on please

but what endogenic suggested would be even better (although leaking the viewkey to 3rd party)

omg

:\

so the tx really happened

Did you try "< kico> ningli[m], try on monerujo use a remote node and set restore height 2301564" ?

i will try your suggestions,cot minutes

yeah if you do that you can see if its there or if (hopefully not) it was sent somewhere else meanwhile

Might have to rescan if setting restore height on an already synced wallet, not sure how monerujo works.

i never share my privatekey or recovery-seed to anybody

Good :)

it confusing me for all afternoon...

thank you guys! I ll try and come back soon

good luck!

i want to know if i use A wallet to receive funds and use another B wallet to recover,

can I still see the transfer record? but i cant even see the transfer record on the A wallet...

i cant see the output tx history even if i recovery an address, right?

whats doin?

i believe all transaction history will be lost

but the account total should be correct.

If A and B are different keys, then obviously not. If A and B are the same seed recovered twice, yes.

Within a wallet, subaddresses are deterministic, so if you recover a wallet, you'll see txes to/from its subaddresses too.

it‘s been solved, i just do like whatendogenic: said

thank you guys so much

:)

yw

what the yw means

yes! well?

You're Welcome

ok

:)

you wussie ?

yeti wookie

ehe kico

?

sup

same old same old

how about you ?

same

:)

Recursive mining

There are a bunch of transactions in every mempool. The coinbase transaction is part

of the master block header, and is not in the mempool. Each mempool has to a high

degree of percentage the same transactions as every other mempool. The transactions

are the most important elements in this system because without users there is no

system. And without transactions from the users in the system, the miners are less

motivated to mine blocks, because the rewards are less. Transactions with higher fees

should be prefered. So in each mempool the transactions are sorted first in ascending

order by the fees. The second sorting criteria also in ascending order is by the sha 256

hash.

Each miner after finding a block wants to propagate that block in the system with the

minimum information as possible. Let every mempool have the same amount of full

slave blocks. Each miner only deals with full slave blocks. Let that number be n.

Let k miners start all mining at the same time. Each miner takes j transactions ( j =

2000 as refered to above ), and fills a slave block, takes it’s hash and appends that

hash to the master block. And starts mining the master block.

After some proof of work, he propagates the first slave block to some of it’s connected

neighbor miners. This can also be in a compact form. The neighbor miners receive the

xslave block and recognize all the transactions within it. The miner also sends a nonce

with the master block header having a low hash value to prove that this is no spam.

The neighbor convinced that it is no spam, sends the same slave block back to that

neighbor. Also with a master block header and a certain nonce proving also that this

reply is no spam.

Proving therefore that he aswell is working on the first same slave block. The miner

receives the same slave-block back and gets interrupted in the mining process.

Because he wants more fees. Therefore he will work on the second slave block, wich

implies the addition of a second hash in the hash list and the modification of the merkle

root. As this changes the master block header, the mining process has to restart for

finding a new nonce.

Each miner is incentivized to interrupt the other miners because that way they have to

start from a new round effort.

After this being done n times there are not enough transactions left in the mempool

to fill another slave block. Therefore each miner having already n slave blocks starts

mining the final master block. When the hash of the master block reaches a certain

low target it gets propagated. Now every node receiving the master block with it’s

hashes of the slave blocks knows wich transactions are within each slave block. Each

miner is also incentivized to be as online as possible reducing therefore the head start

that the miner that found the master block has.

Each miner can choose how many slave blocks to put in it’s master block. So each

miner can partition it’s mining process into n mining sections. Thus each miner has

naturally a mining vector.

How many slave blocks will be mined in average is then a very dynamic and interesting

number.

This model assumes that the underlying incentives are all aligned. The most important

incentive is that the miner wants to propagate the master block with the least amount

of information through the network.

The first visible attack is that miners will just disrupt the others by sending them spam

master blocks.

Why not just link a pastebin or something?

yeah

Or get it published and send me the book

thats not the first time hes done that...

i dont get why..

lol

i have been translating ztm all day long...

to portuguese

and i was wishing for a rude straight denial of that concept of recursive mining.

i should have used pastebin...

i apologize

I appreciate the apology, but slave_blocker isn't around now to see me mention that.

heyyy

I'm using a proper client now

test

test

test

ls

test

icles

test

testicles 1 2

how can I join multiple pools on irssi

you mean /join #freenode ?

channels vs pools?

i'm in freenode

i meant channels

that's what she said

you need to know what channel you're looking for or search

like what kind of channel do you want

i want to be in #monero and #monero-pools at the same time

how do i join both at the same time? if i do /join monero-pools it will dc me from here

then type /join #monero-pools

then you got shitty client

then i will leave here

:/

you must have multiple tabs or way to switch

quadpoint.org/articles/irssi/#:~:te…n,have%20more%20than%2019%20windows.

"1. To switch between windows in Irssi, use Alt-#, where # is 0-9. Windows start at number 1, and Alt-0 goes to window number 10. You can use Alt-q through Alt-o for windows 11 to 19. It is possible to have more than 19 windows. Use Alt with the arrow keys to scroll through the windows."

so alt-0 alt-1 i'd guess

i dont use irssi

i use hexchat & there is channel tree on left or tabs on top

ForestMapper: What client do you use?

What's the best way to benchmark devices?

i hoped that the Phoronix suite could answer that. ended up just downloading xmrig

<slyjester "What's the best way to benchmark"> Throw them against the wall and see which one breaks first

What do you want to benchmark?? Their durability? Water resistance? Memory speed?

Ah sorry hash rates

I just want to see what various hardware can do without having to actually connect to the network

So some approximation of hash rates for randomX

is fluffy donkey related to fluffy pony

he's his father

lol

<slyjester "So some approximation of hash ra"> xmrig.com/benchmark

Thanks

The network connection to the pool is probably negligible, especially when you consider the impact of all the other things going on in the background of the OS

I probably have to write my own clients if I want anything more specific than that