Is there a good place to look at Monero tx fees? e.g. average/lowest/estimation in the past 6 months?

Franck[m], bitinfocharts has those data

if i create a transaction, will it's bytes stay "valid" forever as long as i don't spend the moneros? or is it somehow time-bound

Bish: I assume you can submit it as long as it is still a valid transaction. You can't submit a prefork transaction after a fork if tx format changed.

Also your decoy distribution will be off and your transaction will stick out

If you cannot send messages to the channel, please contact me in order to get +v

selsta: wouldn't it be a nice feature to a have a timestamp inside the transaction

Why?

well, the theoretical attack scenario would be, someone having access to a walelt, and creating a transaction which he or she saves

but the attacker can't use it right now, because it would be obvious

so he does it in a year, because he or she knows the coins will still be there

or rather: i don't see the benefit of not doing that

it's a waste of transaction space

well you don't need to save that stuff inside the blockchain, just when it's inside the pool

you could say a transaction is only valid for x blocks of time after the creation

also I don't get your theoretical scenario

i was phantasizing about smartcard-wallets and terminals

if someone has access to your wallet you have lost already

in my fantasy the smardcard is the only one having the privatekey

you can ask it for a transaction and you're the one submitting it

that way you could have instant transmission of money without having to wait for confirmation

but what if the terminal creates a transaction, but doesn't send it

selsta: you get my scenario ?

it's weird that you can have a set of bytes which can "take" money from your wallet, indefinitely, as long as the coins don't get spent

or rather a tuple of bytes, would be the correct term

sequence

it could be a an optional feature aswell

I might be wrong and other daemons reject transactions that are too old.

But the simpler solution is to use your own node then you can decide when the transaction gets broadcasted to the network.

Also I don't see what the attack is apart from being annoying.

Is Bish on about normal monero stuff now and not beating a dead horse ? I wouldn't mind helping for monero stuff.

It is monero related but more theoretical.

Cool, that's fine.

selsta: as i said im fantasizing about a girocard, with monerocoins on it, there won't be a node around that i can trust

i miss the times when moneromooo didn't /ignore me :[

o/

moneromooo: so Bish asked how long is a transaction valid after you created it without submitting it to the network

Till you double spend one of its inputs.

But you probably don't want to wait too much or the skew in input distribution will make it obvious it's old.

Well, maybe till the next fork, if we obsolete CLSAGs for instance.

yeah and i think it would be a cool feature to have a decaying transaction

guesses about how long it might take to sync from 2202712 to 2224711?

also, what does "password needed (output received) - use the refresh command" mean?

You need to type the password in order to 'decrypt' the output

so if i am attempting to "just leave it running so it can finish refreshing the blockchain" when it hits that point and i need to type my password, it stops?

see "set ask-password"

On the plus side, it means you just received money (on the minus side, it might just be change).

hehe. it ws just change. I got all my issues all sorted out, no loss of funds, thank you all for your guidance over the last 48 hours.

ws/was

sgp_: i cannot answer in -community. i pinged you twice in -community at a couple of weeks of distance. Rehrar answered me, but my follow up question about the LLC itself got unanswered. Maybe my username was different, but i don't see how is that a point. You didn't answer reguardless :)

Hey guys, I guess it is normal for the GUI wallet to do it's first daemon sync for hours and hours? I have a relevantly slow PC...

If you have a spinning disk, it may be days.

If you can use a SSD, do that.

With a SSD it'll be a few hours.

ErCiccione[m]: well I'm sorry I missed it, but I think you're being overly accusatory

We've had a lot of discussion in #monero-space that you could have followed

I don't think i am. I just think that not saying that the forum is owned and managed by a US based for-profit company is not cool. And explaining the choice by saying that you wrote it in the terms of services is even less cool

moneromooo: very optimistic to assume that people read the topic ;D

I guess... :)

Nost forums are owned (or pwned) by US companies.

I guess I don't fully understand what you expected me to say

moneromooo: yeah, the problem is that here we are talking about the company that manages the new monero forum

There is a new monero forum ? :o

If I ran it myself, in your mind should I have made a huge banner saying "I LIVE IN THE US"

Do you need help emigrating ? ^_^

Lol, ideally I want dual citizenship :)

sgp_: "we created a forum which is not managed by the core team, but by the board of a company called Monero Space LLC"

end

i don't think i'm asking crazy things. just to be transparent

moneromooo i think you are missing some parts of the story :)

Oh I definitely am. /me crawls back to code

Well, apologies for not including that, but I also don't really see how that would have changed anything

I said the people who are moderating it

i think it would be more of a big deal if it were some critical piece of infrastructure, or an exchange or marketplace

And we've been clear about who the board members are

Me, jw, nm, seth, scott

Comments like "what if the board changes" are super destructive imo. What if the Monero Core Team changes like it has done?

And we've been clear about who the board members are <- no you weren't. You never mention the LLC or a board of directors on reddit. You mention it only after i say that the forum is managed by a board of a company

Because there is no difference

You hate companies but that's on you

Seriously? you don't see how a legal company has more attack vectors than an open collective of people.

The company actually protects the users from a rogue member

lol, ok

Individuals have unlimited liability .....

Open collective sounds like more vectors

ErCiccione[m]: I think you're mad because you have an incorrect picture of liability

You are mistaking if you think i'm mad. just disappointed

Everyone in Core is individually responsible for everything they do. Not having a registered entity doesn't mean you can do whatever

at least here we have legal recourse against rogue board members

If i cannot make my point clear about why a US based company owning people's data is not good, i don't know what else to say.

you can have illegal recourse too, at hitmen4wownero.i2p

I guess we have very different ways of seeing the matter.

ErCiccione[m]: we can follow higher standards

it's not like "you must be shitty" is in the bylaws

the Monero lead maintainer lives in the US, and no one seems to care

he is in a way subject to unlimited personal liability

other countries have extradition treaties with the US

I think in part, the reason your critical of us is because we try to be transparent about what we're doing so it's easier to criticize things

but please make the criticism constructive and keep the status quo in mind

sgp_: I already made my criticism: you should have disclosed the fact that the forum is owned and maintained by a US-based company. You disagree. I have nothing more to say

I already argue about the transparency. I really disagree about the fact that you have been transparent and i explained on reddit why. Nothing more to say on that side as well

tldr: We have terms of service that people should read it's not being transparent IMO

Maybe the solution for those who disagree in that forum is not to use that forum and keep maintaining and using whatever other forums there are for Monero and promote them. For example, telegram bitmonero chat became Monero Uncensored, mods removed, permissions changed, etc. One single user exploted the service and then left shit of whatever we were building there. Whoever "owns" or has liability on a service will always

have an advantage from others because they held responsibility of what happens and take decicions for others. The more Monero contributors in different places the better for the Monero Community. Let's just build several LLCs then or other organized structures, or just leave some of us build decentralized structures while others build centralized structures. What we have to think is, how are we going to keep building in a

decentralized structure having centralized structures all over us? Moderation is a centralized structure (rules). Uncensored is another structure (anyone there will build their own rules). Monero is by nature uncensored money but how is development going to be organized? Centralized structures threaten decentralized development that's the hard truth.

lh1008: did you read my original discussion on reddit? My point is exactly: make people aware about the issues and let them choose if they want to join or not

Yeah erciccione but you have been saying this for a long time and they are not listening to you, so you just make the awareness for others.

that's exactly what i did

That's why I have good feelings towards you. You're honest.

We either accept moderation or not. I know that the main concern of most of us is to let others tell us what we have to do. We always have someone telling us what to do, but something different is to accept volunteered authority (you put your work on service, you work with a goal) than forced authority. This is hard. We either live with each other and put rules between us or get into an endless fight until someone just

wins, anyway someone will lead.

I think we need to live with each other, I personally don't like forced authority, so that's why I personally work hard to keep volunteered work as a goal to anyone who wants to join in. The main issue is that there are some of us who want to force authority and will fight for it, they are fighting for it right now.

It's happening all over the Monero space (curious Monero Space's name :D haha).

It happened in telegram, it's happening and there is "only one 'official' monero chat", with mods.

It's funny but it's happening. Take care everyone. Centralization in action :).

i had an account on the old forum but never posted or even read it. was there even much going on there besides spam?

kinghat[m]: there was the ffs. other than that just boner pill spam really :(

ya thats what i thought

lol some guy in Linz wanted to get nominated for the darwin award... running around on the street with this decorative hookah pipe a couple of days after a terror attack that involved AK47s: i.imgur.com/DLxLFom.png

bitinfocharts

I'm sick of all the drama and of drama in general. I deleted the post.

ErCiccione: I'm glad you pointed this out. Only a few months ago did I become aware of the importance of decentralization and hearing someone like you who understands it much better than me answer confronting questions really loads up more reasons why it's important to fight for it.

ErCiccione: Yeah I also think it was a good post, a lot of people would have no idea if you didn't bring it up.

,

identitymask viperperidot : thank you. But i really got sick of the drama and of having to answer to accusation of attacking people and poisonous comments. Makes my blood acid and doesn't really worth my health. Happy that at least the post made things clear for somebody.

I think i'll just step back from community related activities and discussions for a bit, and i will just dedicate time to development and all the other Monero projects i take care of.