01:27:54 @freenode_kiwi_94737:matrix.org: Use zergpool. 01:37:54 Do I benefit from filesystem defragmentation on LMDB? 02:53:49 Why does monerod rarely synchronize over tor even though it has tor peers as well as clearnet peers? Is it because of tor network bandwidth? Or, does monerod explicitly choose to synchronize over clearnet? 03:33:24 fatcat[m]: people are probably still using a tor node blocklist 03:33:47 I'm a new tor node. 03:34:13 * I started running a new tor node. 03:34:14 yeah but doesn't your traffic go out from a different existing node 03:34:30 the exit point may be in the blocklist that people were using a while back 03:34:51 ???? 03:35:08 Onion nodes don't touch tor exit nodes. 03:35:14 there was an attack on the network and people had to temporarily load a blocklist to keep their monerod working properly 03:35:20 * Onion monero nodes don't touch tor exit nodes. 03:35:42 I created a new tor hidden service recently. 03:35:43 monero nodes have onion addresses? 03:35:56 My tor hidden service can't be on their blocklist. 03:36:13 i mean the way tor works is that your traffic is obfuscated by exiting a different peer 03:36:19 Has anyone here used an OTC seller like DV Chain to exchange XMR? How was the experience compared to Kraken? 03:36:33 Monerod has seed nodes for clearnet and tor hidden services. 03:36:53 yeah idk you probably know how it works better than I do, i don't use tor 03:37:04 was just saying that a blocklist did exist as a possible cause 03:48:41 vekin, yeah. So when you are using tor the common way, you use exit nodes. so its: you <---> tor exit node <----> tor network <---> tor exit node <---> whatever service you wanted to use but not be tracked using. 03:49:18 however, when you run a hidden service, its like this: tor network. 03:49:42 when you create and use a hidden service, your in the tor network. so there's no exit nodes. so the ban list wouldn't do anything 03:49:47 at least thats how i understand it 03:50:59 ah that makes sense thanks for the explanation 03:51:15 likely he is just running into bandwidth restrictions then 03:58:56 fatcat[m], i would guess its because of bandwidth why your having trouble synchronizing over tor 03:59:07 angrymonkeyboi[m: I am in New North Korea so I can't use either of them but I know someone who used DV Chain about 18 months ago and it was fairly smooth 03:59:30 You mean new zealand? 04:01:55 new york 04:14:24 Did they ban Cryptos in NY?! 04:15:01 regulated on the state level 04:15:27 That's insane 04:15:28 can buy btc and some shitcoins 04:15:54 Wait, so the state tells you which crypto's you can buy or not? 04:16:30 the exchanges need to follow the regulations 04:17:06 Use localmonero... 04:17:19 yes there are options 04:17:36 I'm in WA similar boat most exchanges won't do business with me 04:18:08 annoying holding monero that I can't easily liquidate, but I intend to actually use it so not too inconvenient 04:18:08 kraken said no thank you to NY 04:19:04 makes for easy holding :D 04:19:30 I am not concerned 04:20:24 Does Kraken operate in WA? 04:21:21 how can i get some free mxr? 04:21:45 angrymonkeyboi[m: nope 04:21:46 There is no free money. Money is not free. 04:21:48 Prostitution 04:21:56 BondJames, start mining 04:21:58 neither does coinbase 04:22:02 That thoroughly blows 04:22:18 i'm newbie 04:22:23 freenode_angrymonkeyboi[m]: Rent boy? 04:22:28 WA has some laws that force exchanges to do audits and pay for certifications 04:22:36 so they all just decided to close up shop in WA 04:22:44 the death throes of the old guard 04:23:07 Those fools in Olympia need to understand that WA isn't CA, and can't push its wait around like it's CA 04:23:09 There is one monero-BTC exchange on tor network. 04:23:17 WA doesn't have the economic or population for it 04:23:29 WA is just really progressive on tech laws 04:23:34 probably more so than CA 04:23:41 haaa I wish! 04:23:47 Progressive????! 04:23:55 Or, regressive? 04:24:09 If you're in tech, CA employment contract laws a million times better. Specially around I.P 04:24:09 WA was the first state to ratify net neutrality laws 04:24:21 so, Is it feasible to mine mxr with a laptop ? 04:24:26 back before Ajit in the FCC nerfed it 04:24:36 Feasible, but probably not worth it? 04:24:46 unless it's collecting dust in the corner 04:25:11 calculate the power usage, if you can cover the bill and then some with the proceeds go for it 04:25:19 and electricity is free 04:25:19 If you think about things through, net neutrality laws don't really make sense. Government should just lower the barrier of entry for new ISPs. 04:25:31 Government shouldn't meddle with ISPs at all. 04:25:41 i'm of the opposite opinion 04:25:48 i think internet should be municipal 04:25:58 Actually, government should do nothing.... nothing... 04:25:59 BondJames: you will make more money collecting deposit bottles than mining on a laptop 04:25:59 Disagree. If you have to dig through people's properties to install Fiber, then it's a Utility, and should be regulated as such 04:26:12 angrymonkeyboi[m: yup i agree 04:26:26 I would be happy to not see government ever in my life. 04:26:45 I also am happy to not see fiat currency ever in my life. 04:26:56 I get gigabit fiber with 2ms pings to google for $40 a month :P 04:26:59 there are also these things called........jobs 04:27:09 Move to Sudan? 04:27:35 Mexico and tanzania are closer to anarchy than sudan. 04:27:53 #doubt 04:27:58 did you watch 3 kings?? 04:28:56 oh wait nvm that wasn't in sudan 04:29:01 so the best way get mxr is buy from someone ? 04:29:14 best i subjective 04:29:29 i suggest buying bitcoin with something like cash.app and then using an exchange to buy xmr with it 04:29:33 https://www.reddit.com/r/CryptoCurrency/comments/lglv18/natoshi_sakamoto_funds_proposal_for_tesla_to/ 04:29:40 Upvote if you have an account 04:31:17 I'm so confused anon_udxf6fdz 04:31:17 Why does asking Elon to do something require raising 900 XMR?! 04:32:53 it doesn't 04:33:03 the 900 xmr is gonna buy 3 teslas for 3 charities 04:36:16 why mxr is more privacy than btc? 04:39:19 anon_udxf6fdz[m]: that was deleted cause there was a mistake in the post, it should be reposted somewhere 04:39:37 https://www.monero.how/how-does-monero-privacy-work 04:40:20 thx 04:42:05 new posts on r/cryptocurrency https://www.reddit.com/r/CryptoCurrency/comments/lglrp2/monero_the_true_cypherpunk_cryptocurrency_is/ 04:42:37 https://www.reddit.com/r/CryptoCurrency/comments/lglx97/monero_community_will_donate_teslas_to_charities/ 05:03:52 until now i have 3.5 xmr 05:17:12 afk 05:28:56 Is there a recommended no-kyc exchange to purchase XMR? 05:29:38 some on recommend a ios app for irc 05:29:40 tradeogre is cool 05:32:08 bisq 05:35:27 > > <@strider:bitcoinenemies.com> Is there a recommended no-kyc exchange to purchase XMR? 05:35:27 > bisq 05:35:27 just know that its only for btc/xmr pair. and requires a 0.0065 btc security deposit 05:36:11 Thanks! 06:54:39 gnu screen exploit exploitable over irssi? https://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/screen-devel/2020-02/msg00007.html 06:56:31 How does monerod read and write LMDB? 06:57:31 Does monerod incur a lot of random read and sequential write? 07:15:37 Which filesystem operation is the bottleneck on HDD for monerod? 07:30:59 good morning folks 07:31:24 Morning :) 07:32:08 good day. 08:21:30 o/ raecarruth 08:22:22 BohemianHacks: \o 08:25:53 this channel is a bit more sleepy than doge, but thats true on most the cryptos on freenode I have seen 08:26:02 could also be that its 2am in freedom land 08:27:53 muh freedom 08:43:21 fatcat[m]: verifying transactions you need to read the mixins, which are 11 earlier "random" transactions ... 08:43:39 so a lot of random reads 08:45:46 What about writes? 08:46:00 Does monerod push writing performance of HDDs? 08:47:27 im really impressed with how fast this is syncing 08:47:51 so happy to see monero kicking butt all these years later 09:06:06 Does monerod push writing performance of btrfs with copy-on-write on HDD? 09:09:20 when it's not syncing the blockchain it's fine 09:09:22 on my hdd 09:09:30 but for syncing it took a few days 09:21:18 I'm syncing on btrfs without copy-on-write. It seems to be a bit faster, but I don't know how much faster it is without copy-on-write. 09:21:29 I will also experiment with xfs. 09:21:53 xfs is said to be pretty fast 09:21:58 I looked at a comparison once 09:22:02 a recent one too 09:22:35 with new file systems like btrfs and ext3/ext4 you need to make those changes like disable journaling, cow, etc. noatime 09:22:52 need to? 09:23:12 yeah if you want something like monero to run well, but this pertains more to slow drives like magnetic disks 09:23:18 if you have an ssd it may not be needed 09:24:09 you could disable these very slow and inefficient features temporarily while you sync the block chain the first time and then turn them on maybe 09:24:26 the best thing is actually to store the entire blockchain in RAM 09:25:09 if you can find a system that has enough memory you mount a ram-based file system and then sync the block chain fast, then when finished copy it onto the disk 09:25:17 Are you sure that journaling is a bottleneck in writing onto LMDB? 09:25:30 when I was using ext4 I think it had a big impact 09:25:36 Copy-on-write may be a bottleneck, but metadata journaling doesn't incur a lot of burden. 09:25:38 you can try it out and see 09:26:11 Monero can fit in 64 gigs of RAM right? 09:26:17 that's not impossible 09:26:19 `journal_async_commit` ext4 mount option increases writing performance. 09:27:52 Big impact on what? 09:28:34 As long as monerod writes sequentially, verifying blocks(random reads) should take a lot longer than actually writing blocks. 09:29:56 probably yes 09:30:12 you are the expert 09:37:20 xfs is at least 33% faster than btrfs. ext4 is close to xfs in speed. 09:38:02 Does monerod write sequentially or randomly during synchronization? 09:40:45 I'm guessing it writes fairly sequentially , but hyc would know. It does however need lots of random reads during those writes 09:41:44 http://www.lmdb.tech/doc/ says 09:41:44 > Data pages use a copy-on- write strategy so no active data pages are ever overwritten, which also provides resistance to corruption and eliminates the need of any special recovery procedures after a system crash. 09:41:44 > Writes are fully serialized; only one write transaction may be active at a time, which guarantees that writers can never deadlock. 09:51:52 so random reads + sequential writes 09:53:11 And, copy on overwrite. 10:30:08 Writes are not sequential. 10:30:57 Oh wait. They are not logically sequential, but the free page reuse or alloc might make it more sequential, so scratch that. 13:08:38 /!\ this channel has moved to ##hamradio /!\ 13:12:09 /!\ this channel has moved to #nyymit /!\ 13:13:01 /!\ this channel has moved to #nyymit /!\ 13:13:31 ban. 13:13:36 /!\ this channel has moved to #nyymit /!\ 13:14:56 jess: generic freebode spam or monero related? 13:15:01 freenode* 13:15:03 generic 13:27:42 so what's up with us trying to suck Elon Musk's dick for some PR 13:28:21 I don't remember seeing any sort of feedback time for that proposal 13:29:11 'us' 13:29:46 The proposers inappropriately used the term 'Monero community', should not be seen as the action of the full community imo 13:30:10 that's what I'm saying. How did this get merged and funded so fast with what appears to be zero community feedback 13:30:47 and that... is a right question 13:31:23 Whoever did that were in the land of freedom, so they'll wake up soon and hopefully answer it 13:31:45 It seems to have been a premeditated effort. Shouldn't have gone through CCS or claim to be at the behest of the whole community. 13:32:04 890 is XMR is like... we could hire a full time coder for freaking 2 years 13:32:35 it says in the proposal that it will be refunded if not successful, which will likely be the case 13:32:58 so it still can to go to development in the long run 13:33:14 luigi explained why it was merged early here https://repo.getmonero.org/monero-project/ccs-proposals/-/merge_requests/209#note_10675 13:33:15 yeah all I have to go is give somebody my tax ID lol 13:33:49 but I also think that the CCS shouldn't have been used for this 13:34:27 sech1: https://old.reddit.com/r/Monero/comments/lgptpr/dear_monerotesla_proposal_you_do_not_represent/gmtanxd/?context=3 13:34:28 Yeah, CCS was not a good fit here. 13:34:38 there's monero being used for shilling monero on twitter to elon/tesla? sheesh 13:34:41 "Strong risk of sniping" I mean who in their right mind would seriously consider doing something like this? 13:34:47 If a cabal of rich people want to fund this, go for it! Don't mind the initiative. 13:35:05 But it wasn't a community decision or effort, it was done behind closed doors ahead of time. 13:35:18 That doesn't mean the initiative shouldn't happen, theyre free to drive it if they want. 13:35:22 So other coins would see CCS proposal to buy 3 Teslas, and front-run this? Seriously? 13:36:10 Even the "fast-tracked due to previous commitment for most of the funding" is a terrible argument 13:36:32 well ok, now that I actually read it it's not sooooo terrible but meeh 13:36:46 sethsimmons: you have a point re: the CCS. I am xnovaxcp on reddit (who made that post that debruyne linked). We probably should have done this as a separate group initiative. The thought of doing it as a CCS was that it would show off the monero community fundraising to the larger set of crypto users, but in retrospect maybe that was misguided 13:36:48 It just shouldnt have gone through the CCS 13:36:53 Other than I don't see the issue. 13:36:58 welp. glad to see it's drawn some attention anyway and it wasn't just me who looked at the CCS last night and went, what??? 13:37:10 Yeah, if it was truly community funded/discussed, that would be true. 13:37:22 Instead it was used for the appearance of community funding and discussion. 13:37:33 It's not the end of the world, just something to learn from IMO. 13:37:34 robbyd[m]: Perhaps you should create a separate thread, then everyone can air their criticism there 13:37:37 And it allows you to respond 13:38:29 robbyd[m]: Actually I'd strongly recommend to post that comment as separate thread 13:38:36 It is not going to get noticed now, or very little 13:38:43 dEBRUYNE: sure 13:39:15 can I just point out that since this person is anonymous they could very well be aiming to have a Tesla "donated" to themselves. there's just so much about this that needs to be considered, and wasn't 13:39:16 Yeah would be great to hear from an "insider" 🙂 13:39:47 not sure what charity needs a Tesla anyway that just seems weird 13:40:02 they be like, "can we just get $50k instead" 13:40:15 buying them with xmr.to would have been cool too :( 13:40:24 and we would say ok probably in that scenario 13:40:29 I understand the point -- get Elon to accept Monero and use the vehicle (no pun intended) as a way to show that its being accepted. 13:40:29 Aka Luigi1111, since he's the one who merged the PR 13:40:38 It was more than just them. 13:41:04 the CCS says the charity needs to "Tweet about how a Tesla Model 3 would be used by the charity." 13:41:17 14:36 welp. glad to see it's drawn some attention anyway and it wasn't just me who looked at the CCS last night and went, what??? <-- I thought I ended up on a phishing site seeing that 800 XMR were funded for a proposal I never heard about lol 13:41:19 it's set up for the charities to have to be aware of the competition and to choose to participate 13:41:37 It seems to me that many people agree that this doesn't seem to represent a community guided idea and I tend to dislike this kind of approach in general and in particular in this case 13:42:39 True. 13:42:41 If this wasn't done through the CCS and wasn't called a community-wide initiative there is no problem IMO 13:42:41 Wealthy Monero holders are free to do what they want with their Monero, for Monero. 13:42:47 so do we undo it from the CCS, do refunds to the contributors and start again as MoneroBizDev or some other Monero initiative? 13:42:49 But the CCS was misused and wording was poorly chosen. 13:43:28 here you go: https://www.reddit.com/r/Monero/comments/lgtvfd/the_reasoning_behind_monerotesla/ 13:43:35 ^^^^ 13:43:35 Yes that would be good 13:44:55 I'm ok with that. sgp_ ' 13:45:33 can we delete all reddit criticism on this.. so people don't tweet that "Look monero community wasn't behind this! HAHA!" 13:46:05 well.. but that is actually what happened 13:46:13 and the reddit post seems to confirm that formally and substancially 13:46:26 yeah but it looks bad :) 13:47:07 it does yes, that's what happened. 13:47:43 and that I would not define eleven people as several members of the community 13:48:40 My favorite comment so far: "Tesla is a mass surveillance car" 13:49:12 mfoolb: eleven are the donations to the CCS proposal as far as i understood, not the number of people involved. There is no clarity about who is behind the proposal itself yet. 13:49:40 no clarity with a ccs is not that communitywise IMO 13:50:30 check the reddit post, we are fine moving this into an affiliated entity: https://www.reddit.com/r/Monero/comments/lgtvfd/the_reasoning_behind_monerotesla/ 13:51:19 or at least I am, I don't speak for everyone, but it's something we all (as in everyone in the Monero community) can discuss today 13:51:29 I mean you're free to do what you're like but if you're getting this much backlash against the proposal itself, and not just how the CCS is used, then maybe reconsider your approach. just my 2c. 13:52:36 and in the end someone thinks that Elon Musk will shill Monero because you buy three car?! I don't like it and probably I don't get it 13:52:51 ^^ 13:55:19 the main intent was always to raise interest in monero. Elon _might_ get a glance of this and see that Monero even exists. If that happens that would be awesome, but it would be a huge bonus, and is not necessary to any "success" of this 13:55:40 the master plan behind this is probably piggy-backing Elon's popularity and returning these 890 XMR after 21 days 13:55:45 I mean I get it 13:55:53 but it does more harm IMHO 13:56:12 it feels a bit cheap :/ 13:56:20 what a morally cheap marketing stunt 13:56:20 well it actually is 13:57:19 I legit though it was a joke at first, even the "Natoshi Sakamoto" name used in the proposal 13:57:32 we were considering giving one of the teslas away even if it didn't work out. a few people were in favor of that, but nothing was settled yet 13:57:36 Still almost 2 months until April though... 13:58:14 Elon for sure knows already Monero exists 13:58:47 people are free to pull the stunts they want with their money though 13:59:05 no problems with that ^ 13:59:17 but using CCS and speaking for community behind their backs... 13:59:24 it's ok, might raise some awareness. specially with so many people entering this space 13:59:32 agreed with that sech1 13:59:36 well this is actually with the use of the monero community name and a getmonero mail address 13:59:37 ComplyLast: it is a whole different level 13:59:40 seems like the proponents will revert that asap 13:59:45 "Elon for sure knows already Monero exists" <-- I highly doubt that, actually 13:59:48 I'm sensitive to arguments about speaking for community. might need some rewording 13:59:52 he only recently started taking crypto seriously 13:59:59 come on, Elon knows about Doge! 14:00:07 luigi1111: I appreciate that 14:00:08 Fucking Dogecoin! 14:00:27 everyone knows about doge 14:00:33 I don't get whats special about dogecoin 14:00:35 Everyone and their doge* 14:05:03 dEBRUYNE: can't accept your DM, bridges must still be struggling 😕 14:05:23 keep it public guys 14:05:25 like bitcoin 14:05:31 non fungible conversations, please. 14:05:58 a66 14:06:01 ^^ 14:09:38 https://www.reddit.com/r/Monero/comments/lgtvfd/comment/gmtf5t8 14:10:02 sethsimmons: it's not about the bridges. The monero rooms are configure incorrectly: https://github.com/monero-project/meta/issues/549#issuecomment-775994083 14:10:42 I hope the fact that the community has clearly expressed a contrary opinion will produce an adeguate feedback from most of the senior members in the community. I've been around here for only around 18 months and I've never seen anything so bad for the community 14:10:44 but wait you should be using the freenode bridge anyway. Don't know if that's relevant then. 14:11:07 It worked on the 6th try 14:11:23 Its a DM to Freenode so shouldn't be room-related, but could be a config issue with monero.social 14:16:15 Do we know what charities are getting the Tesla's? 14:16:15 This could be a huge risk to the monero community if the person organizing it gives the cars to an unsavory organization while the /r/monero community endorses it without knowing.. 14:22:32 no, it's even worse. the charities are supposed to compete for the cars. on twitter. 14:23:26 doesn't say anything at all about who makes this decision or how..... 14:23:45 lol what? 14:24:08 literally all it says is "the Monero Community will select our three favorite charities to receive Teslas" 14:24:42 then there's a couple of disqualifiers at the bottom of the page, but nothing else 14:26:08 I swear it almost looks like somebody trying to donate some tax free teslas to themselves or something. super dodgy imo 14:26:20 nut the thing is what are these non-profits supposed to do with teslas? Wouldn't giving the XMR directly to them be much better? 14:26:52 yes, it would. I can't think of a single non-profit where a Model 3 would be considered a smart purchase or a particulrly useful donation 14:28:05 weird imo 14:28:44 plus Teslas literally conduct surveillance on their users I mean.... come on. 14:28:49 We should take these off the subreddit until more information is asked. 14:28:49 And why the hell was the CCS merged so quickly. Someone's up to hanky-panky? 14:29:05 seems that way 14:29:22 this is the explanation from luigi, such as it is: https://repo.getmonero.org/monero-project/ccs-proposals/-/merge_requests/209 14:29:28 And their build quality is trash 14:29:28 @Lyza yeah. I would expect better from "the Monero community" 14:30:15 I don't believe any funny business. some suboptimal choices in excitement and rush, yes 14:30:59 I just thought there was a process for this, so pretty much unhappy to see one person unilaterally making such decisions 14:31:41 exceptionally poor judgement imo. I mean, respect and all. genuinely. but this is bad bro 14:32:01 not even a good CCS, dunno what you were excited about 14:32:34 There's huge risk to the reputation of the community as a whole here. This is a big deal 14:33:02 Hello 👋 😊 14:35:42 IMO you are overstating things here. The fact that the community is reasoning through this and self regulating, and hopefully coming up with an adjusted effort that is better than it was before, is great. 14:36:37 Hi namsardar 🙂 good to see you on IRC! 14:46:51 robbyd[m]: sorry what? we are being forced to reason through the implications as the proposal already got its way. 14:48:42 there is no "good outcome" here. everybody has to compromise due to what happened, and there is certainly reputational impact for both the community and those that took the decisions. 14:48:59 whether one thinks its net positive or negative is a matter of opinion. 14:49:35 but i think it should be clear that money upfront made a marketing trick appear. 14:50:50 there will be similar future awareness efforts (e.g. meme contests, merchandise contests, possibly other well intentioned stunts) and we will have a much better precedence on how to organize them. we fucked up in that regard, I admit, and we are working to fix it 14:51:57 right. but who is we? 14:52:21 heya nam, venturing off twitter I see! 14:52:30 that was the main intent. any random shitcoin can say they will donate $150K but not actually have it. our thinking was that by having it signed sealed and delivered, it would be taken more seriously, as well as showing off the CCS system. we were wrong there obviously 14:52:37 robbyd[m]: and its not "awareness". it's marketing. 14:53:03 what do you think the point of marketing is? 14:53:10 sell more product 14:53:15 what do you think it is? 14:53:44 it's first and foremost to raise awareness. awareness and need sells product 14:54:43 (perceived need at least, marketing also tries to create need, but I think we don't have to do that here...people just need to know monero exists) 14:55:07 bullshit. marketing's main focus is to manipulate or convince people into thinking they "need" something. 14:55:14 create need? 14:55:18 what does that even mean? 14:55:21 no harm... 14:55:31 it means creating the feeling of need. it's still gross tho 14:55:35 create need means just what you said. 14:55:43 its fucking horrible, imo 14:55:50 I feel the same way with you about it 14:55:59 sure 14:56:01 thats why I said monero doesn't need to create need 14:56:12 everyone needs privacy and financial freedom 14:56:15 no, we obviously need to buy Teslas! 14:56:33 we just need to raise awareness that this even exists 14:56:47 look. we aren't going to agree here 14:57:12 we just need to raise awareness that this even exists --> most people don't understand why it is useful, until the boot comes crashing down their face, then suddenly they do 14:57:17 (sadly) 14:58:06 apparently in this short time with all this controversy, this effort has generated more twitter engagement than the perkins coie whitepaper, which has been hanging out there for months and is pinned. if you don't know about monero, and you go to monerotesla.com, you just learned. and some non profit will benefit from this even if Elon takes no interest 14:58:18 of course, by then it's a bit too little too late. my point being, raising awareness is not enough. explaining why it's important is also necessary. only a tiny minority of people seem to get why inherently 14:58:26 I'm perfectly okay with marketing monero. The issue I have is that it looks like the community is still endorsing this Model 3 donation thing when we don't know where they're going. 14:58:26 How are we okay with attaching our name to something we don't know anything about?? 14:58:40 robbyd[m]: how does a non-profit benefit if the money is returned? 14:58:42 it created twitter engagement because you made a huge controversy, so congrats I guess 14:58:46 Let's take a step back, and get some details first 14:58:49 cause they get twitter exposure? 14:58:50 angrymonkeyboi: totally agreed. we are changing that out 14:59:21 you literally get charities begging for teslas that may not even arrive 14:59:24 we (the small group that worked this thing out) were naive on that front and are resolving it 14:59:25 how is that a good thing? 14:59:47 it's honestly one of the worst ways I can think of to spend 150 grand, giving it to elon musk 14:59:52 read the CCS, which is linked twice on the landing page. we make it abundantly clear 15:00:24 Lyza: I see it as the best way to spend 150 grand, getting several thousand new users and a shit ton of interest 15:00:41 it's. not. about. elon. musk. 15:00:46 robbyd[m]: > Note that selected charities will not receive a donated Tesla Model 3 if the success criteria below are not met. 15:00:54 those are things you think will happen, not things that will certainly happen 15:01:21 it's literally targeting elon musk of course it's about him don't act naive 15:01:30 robbyd[m]: so again - how do they benefit if the stipulations are not met? 15:01:56 Lyza: that's the definition of trying to do anything. nothing is ever certain but I can tell you, people will not just magically learn about Monero. Not in any large quantity, anyhow 15:02:22 I tell you what. If I came to the community with an idea and got this much pushback I'd just be like shit, my bad. But that's me though 15:02:41 so spend 150k on twitter bots, ltiearlly a better use of moneyt 15:02:49 midipoet: as it is written, they don't financially benefit. that was the point of having clearly written criteria. however, we will be doing something even if it doesn't work out. we just hadn't finalized it yet 15:03:04 just fucking great then - what the fuck is the point 15:03:07 i mean... i'd just keep the donations 15:03:09 and laugh 15:03:40 glad you don't run CCS 15:04:00 pump monero prices and get free monero then dump it 15:04:11