01:51:38 <xtuh> h, is that means that mining with daemon have some chances?
01:51:39 <xtuh> https://pastebin.com/1MujF1Et
01:58:14 <nioc> that's info about what is happening on the blockchain, has no bearing on your mining success
02:00:33 <nioc> if you solo mine at 2000 H/s then on average can expect a block in a bit over 3 years
02:16:40 <xtuh> ok. thanks
04:38:49 <bigslim[m]> Sooo... that CipherTrace deal. Anyone have any thoughts on it? Has anyone reviewed their patents they filed or is there no data supplied to public regarding their technology used?
04:39:45 <bigslim[m]> I’m curious to read into it. I’m guessing Justin was the one who talked with cointelegraph
05:12:26 <bigslim[m]> https://ciphertrace.com/ciphertrace-files-two-monero-cryptocurrency-tracing-patents/
05:16:53 <nioc> With 45% of darknet markets now supporting Monero—the second-favorite cryptocurrency of choice among criminals, just behind bitcoin
05:17:07 <nioc> but we are so behind the usd
05:17:21 <nioc> come on guys
05:18:23 <nioc> CipherTrace has always been an advocate of user privacy.
05:18:52 <nioc> hed asplode
05:20:36 <nioc> they only use one tiny cookie wen you visit their site
05:20:55 <nioc> oh it's tiny?
05:21:03 <bigslim[m]> Heh
05:21:05 <nioc> well if it's tiny then ok
05:21:18 <bigslim[m]> Duck duck go
05:21:28 <nioc> what harm could a little bunny rabbit do?
05:22:38 <bigslim[m]> What harm could drug cartels do with anonymous transactions, it’s just a little privacy.
05:23:33 <bigslim[m]> It’s funny their parent filed, included chain analysis from 2018...
05:24:44 <nioc> good thing that harm is under control now
06:00:35 <Mochi101> Can find the patent here: https://patents.google.com/patent/WO2020106638A1
06:01:50 <Mochi101> 2020-05-28
06:01:51 <Mochi101> Publication of WO2020106638A1
06:02:07 <Mochi101> Seems it was first filed in 2018 though
08:28:57 <Deyaa> Hello
08:29:33 <Deyaa> I wonder what is the best miner for XMR??
09:01:56 <xtuh> i know xmr-stak and xm-rig
10:22:11 <questi> hi
10:23:11 <questi> there were news that some company soft can to a degree trace monero
10:24:03 <questi> i would say their probabilstic model is not accurate
10:25:08 <questi> am i wrong
11:33:34 <endor00[m]> <questi "i would say their probabilstic m"> How could you say that if you don't even know what their model is?
11:35:28 <endor00[m]> Lots of people dismissing what they hear without even checking, based on one bad interview from a CEO
11:35:50 <endor00[m]> Perfect recipe for getting caught with your pants down
13:27:36 <sethsimmons> Yup, definitely worth assuming the worst and trying to figure out how they do their probabalistic guesses and keep iterating to close off those holes.
13:28:05 <sethsimmons> I think there is good reason to think their tool is ineffective, but that doesn't mean we ignore the threat -- its a great chance to take a second look at some of the known weaknesses and try to mitigate or remove them.
14:20:09 <bigslim[m]> <sethsimmons "Yup, definitely worth assuming t"> Definitely taking some knowns and then using ML to guess the rest
14:38:52 <dixie__flatline[> <bigslim[m] "Definitely taking some knowns an"> have they demonstrated their capabilities publicly yet?
14:39:03 <dixie__flatline[> have they shown publicly some coin flows in monero transactions?
14:39:40 <dixie__flatline[> or is it all smoke and mirrors
14:40:05 <dixie__flatline[> something to scare people from using monero, while grabbing some government money
14:41:43 <LyzaL> why would they demonstrate it?
14:42:45 <LyzaL> we *might* get some information if / when this tech is ever used in a court case against somebody, since the prosecution will have to explain their evidence, but I feel like just openly demonstrating / disclosing their techniques would not be in their interest
14:42:49 <dixie__flatline[> if they have it working well, that would be lotta prestige for their company
14:44:06 <LyzaL> true but if they've got government contracts they probably have an even bigger interest in keeping pleasing hoever is paying them, and whoever is paying them definitely does not benefit from having the tech disclosed openly
14:45:38 <dixie__flatline[> the thing is, if ciphertrace is indeed capable of tracing coins (not just probabilistically, but deterministically), then, the company would get much money from other possible sources than the current puny government payout of, what, 625k USD?
14:45:39 <charolastra> they want international gov contracts. on the other hand that israelian iphone cracking company doesn't show off either
14:46:28 <LyzaL> I mean, probabilistic is good enough for a warrant though
14:46:33 <LyzaL> it doesn't have to be 100%
14:49:30 <charolastra> they might as well just lie (like they did with iraq, twice)
14:51:35 <dixie__flatline[> well, this is moving beyond the coin surveillance, if they get to choose to inciriminate people for 50 percent probability, etc
14:52:24 <LyzaL> the legal line for acquiring a warrant is mere probable cause
14:53:03 <dixie__flatline[> if that's the case, as we all know, one should attach as little as possible metadata to his monero transactions
14:53:07 <LyzaL> probabilistic is gonna be enough to put anyone in jail by itself but they can use stuff like that to fish for more evidence
14:53:14 <dixie__flatline[> so that he can evade those warrants based on probabilities
14:53:29 <LyzaL> isn't* I meant to say
14:54:03 <LyzaL> yeah for sure
14:54:34 <LyzaL> better support for i2p is gonna help a ton with that, but people still need to be careful what they share
14:55:45 <dixie__flatline[> I am not familiar with i2p network, but I hear it is a much more anon network than tor
14:56:07 <dixie__flatline[> if that's the case, ability to run a node and connect with other nodes, send transactions, etc, on i2p would be great.
14:56:14 <dixie__flatline[> all the more power for the little man
14:58:32 <LyzaL> i2p already works (as does tor) but it requires a little setup. we seem to be moving towards being able to integrate it in the GUI though
14:59:02 <LyzaL> getting more people using it is the big thing
14:59:10 <bigslim[m]> I think that they potentially have a start but in no way can fully trace coins like Monero. You have givens like exchange accounts and addresses and those addresses that have been withdrawn to as well as other accounts publicly known. Tracing rings and others is pretty much unknown however pretty sure they are using quantum computing to “guess”
14:59:12 <dixie__flatline[> sure
14:59:50 <dixie__flatline[> they are using quantum computing? really?
15:00:19 <donkeydonkey[m]> is there a good web article on how to use i2p. and also is there a page on what metadata should be omitted to increase privacy? thanks y'all
15:01:15 <dixie__flatline[> an article on metadata with regards to monero transactions would be nice
15:01:29 <dixie__flatline[> cc: kayront
15:02:40 <bigslim[m]> Government money for anything crypto tracing most likely has quantum computing behind it.
15:03:09 <LyzaL> it's slightly dated now but https://www.getmonero.org/resources/user-guides/node-i2p-zero.html
15:03:12 <dixie__flatline[> I was surprised only because that tech is so early currenty?
15:03:16 <bigslim[m]> Scraping onion explorers is quite nice
15:03:27 <LyzaL> you no longer need to manually add peers with --add-peer
15:03:34 <donkeydonkey[m]> <LyzaL "it's slightly dated now but http"> thx
15:03:39 <bigslim[m]> dixie__flatline: the tech is only new “to the public”
15:04:07 <dixie__flatline[> bigslim: yeah, probs. it's an unknown unknown for us, the public, currently.
15:04:15 <LyzaL> also the latest release of i2p-zero, 1.18, is broken, you need to download 1.17 instead
15:04:24 <bigslim[m]> You want to solve bug problems you been big firepower. Gpu/cpu farms can only do so much.
15:04:40 <dixie__flatline[> <LyzaL "also the latest release of i2p-z"> ouch
15:05:11 <bigslim[m]> Biotechs using lots of ML to solve covid vaccine
15:05:32 <LyzaL> there actually is a work around for using 1.18 but 1.17 is the recommended sol'n. https://github.com/i2p-zero/i2p-zero/issues/31
15:16:50 <charolastra> "Government money for anything crypto tracing most likely has quantum computing behind it." so it's backed by voodoo mumbo jumbo?
15:17:49 <lh1008[m]> Hello everyone, I think I caught a bug, check it out: https://github.com/monero-project/monero/issues/7041
15:18:59 <questi> hello
15:19:03 <questi> who is awake?
15:19:16 <raecarruth> me
15:19:35 <dixie__flatline[> questi: I am awaken.
15:21:49 <azy> im pretty woke
15:28:47 <questi> have you read a recent article about a company that claims it can trace monero??>
15:29:22 <dixie__flatline[> questi: scroll u
15:29:25 <dixie__flatline[> *ip
15:29:28 <dixie__flatline[> *up
15:29:31 <nioc> did this company give any proof?
15:29:34 <dixie__flatline[> we just had a small convo on that
15:29:44 <dixie__flatline[> nioc: not yet.
15:29:46 <dixie__flatline[> afaik
15:29:50 <questi> ooohhh I was logged out
15:30:01 <questi> maybe they are bluffing
15:30:10 <nioc> dixie__flatline[: yes I know :)
15:30:19 <dixie__flatline[> <questi "ooohhh I was logged out"> you can't see the message history on irc?
15:30:34 <questi> The U.S. Department of Homeland Security contracted with CipherTrace for a total of $3.6 million—with $2.4 million already paid—to create the Monero tracing tool. 
15:31:02 <questi> I logged via web so no
15:31:04 <questi> via www
15:31:17 <dixie__flatline[> come to matrix
15:31:19 <nioc> they both have one and are creating one
15:31:37 <nioc> ok
15:31:44 <questi> Although the Monero community is viewing the CipherTrace tool as a  negative, the tracking tool might actually save—or at least  postpone—Monero from its inevitable demise. Now that analytics software  exists for Monero, exchanges and governments can once again potential  permit Monero
15:31:46 <questi> lool
15:32:02 <questi> I think monero is  far from demise
15:32:05 <dixie__flatline[> inevitable demise
15:32:17 <dixie__flatline[> ciphertrace the holy savior
15:32:19 <hyc> sounds like nonsense, since "analytics software exists for Monero" is false
15:32:31 <dixie__flatline[> obviously
15:32:37 <dixie__flatline[> it's just marketing framing
15:33:16 <hyc> the only thing that can be true, at most, is that they're working on it, and they convinced the USgov to give them a lot of money to work on it
15:33:30 <questi> which is a neat trick
15:33:31 <questi> :)
15:33:32 <hyc> not that they have anything useful as a result
15:34:02 <hyc> meh, the USgov spends $300 on a screwdriver. all it takes is a guy in the right suit
15:34:17 <questi> 300?
15:34:33 <questi> federalscrewdrivers.com lol
15:34:35 <questi> my new biz
15:34:48 <questi> fully certified made in usa
15:34:58 <questi> traceable srewdrivers
15:39:24 <hyc> http://www.scragged.com/articles/yes-virginia-a-298-hammer-really-costs-our-government-100
15:47:43 <yanmaani> How about a magic trick?
15:47:58 <yanmaani> I'm going to make $625k of government money
15:48:02 <yanmaani> disappear
15:48:09 <yanmaani> And ta-da, it's gone!
15:49:08 <questi> ohhh lol
15:50:11 <hyc> can pretty much guarantee that 90% of that money will go into executives' pockets, hardly any will go into actual software development
15:51:58 <questi> why
15:52:03 <questi> have you worked in such company?
15:52:12 <questi> I have worked in some corps quit to travel :)
16:00:27 <questi> is offtopic allowed here?
16:01:45 <azy> how big is the pruned db currently?
16:01:57 <nioc> 30-35Gb
16:02:13 <azy> ty
16:02:27 <nioc> I don't have one but that's wat I hear
16:04:20 <questi> anyone here is in Ireland or Canada?
16:04:21 <questi> :)
16:22:44 <questi> i can hear a sound of laptop fan
16:22:46 <questi> silence :P
17:23:36 <Mochi101> azy, just over 30Gb (I have a pruned and synced db)
17:38:11 <lithiumpt> how is a txid generated? i suppose it's random, can someone point me to the code?
17:41:52 <moneromooo> calculate_transaction_hash IIRC
17:42:03 <moneromooo> Hashes of serialized data.
19:04:09 <focus-u-f> azy: 30G     /mnt/.bitmonero/lmdb
19:05:30 <focus-u-f> 30210 MB
19:10:56 <azy> ty
19:40:52 <selsta> if someone uses linux please help at testing https://old.reddit.com/r/Monero/comments/jzoous/linux_gui_testers_needed
19:47:21 <donkeydonkey[m]> started just fine. though it couldnt autostart the daemon. i started the daemon from the commnand line and it worked just fine. arch linux.
19:47:48 <selsta> donkeydonkey[m]: maybe permission related
19:48:01 <selsta> you have to set daemon to executable too
19:48:08 <selsta> thanks for testing
19:48:18 <donkeydonkey[m]> ohh right cause its gonna use the one provided.
19:48:26 <donkeydonkey[m]> not mine that i usually use.
19:48:38 <donkeydonkey[m]> do you want me to report it on that web page
19:48:48 <selsta> not necessary
19:51:25 <donkeydonkey[m]> you were right i made the daemon executable and it autostarted. i just posted a short one that it worked on arch.
21:12:16 <Criispin> hi :) whats moneros fork cycle still twice a year?
21:13:10 <selsta> no
21:13:15 <selsta> less often
21:13:30 <selsta> seems 9-12 months currently
21:13:55 <Criispin> okey thanks :)
22:13:56 <goldenhaze[m]> TRX 2020/23 november  legit bot - https://t.me/TronGoldLtdBot?start=1096151644
22:13:56 <goldenhaze[m]> Doge 2020/23 November legit bot - https://t.me/DogeGoldBot?start=1096151644
22:13:56 <goldenhaze[m]> https://youtu.be/Y-UjK_YEhxs
22:17:38 <d4rkp1r4t3> rekt