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Inge-
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Inge-
Wen RandomX in Conways game of life?
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sech1
I think someone built even the whole CPU emulator in game of life
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selsta
someone built game of life in game of life
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Inge-
game-of-life-ception
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sech1
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sech1
Only 2,000,000 generations to go through 1 CPU cycle, lol
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Inge-
game-of-life in game-of-life as proof-of-work
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gingeropolous
so wownero is contemplating what to do as a small network living alongside a large network that both use the same hardware for their PoW
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moneromooo
I'd merge mine.
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moneromooo
Though it has the "only one large pool supports it" failure mode, which is bad...
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moneromooo
But the one pool can already screw you if it wants to anyway, so...
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moneromooo
I'd like to see coins merge mine with monero. It's another incentive based reason to mine monero.
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moneromooo
Though I suppose if many do, you might end up with spammy coinbases since it requires a hash per coin I think.
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» moneromooo needs to look at how this works exactly
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sech1
merge mining adds more bloat to the other coin, not Monero
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moneromooo
Interesting. That's great news :)
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sech1
It's more like they mine Monero's PoW but have their own difficulty. In case solution difficulty is enough for Monero, it'll also mine Monero block
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sech1
Not sure, maybe they'll also add some more extra bytes to that block though
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moneromooo
AFAIK, they do. I assumed you knew better so changed my belief, but now I'm not so sure.
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moneromooo
I found an explanation for something that's merged mine with bitcoin and they seem to say they do stuf something in the bitcoin coinbase.
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moneromooo
48 bytes for that particular case.
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sech1
I guess they need to add some reference/id to their own chain in the mined block
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tromp_
they need to commit to the new block on other chain
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tromp_
usually by a 32 byte hash
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gingeropolous
there's a strong anti merge mine sense:
wownero/meta #27
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gingeropolous
ive been trying to mull over its validity
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moneromooo
So the objections are basically "not independent of monero" and "prevents regular joes from mining in practice due to high diff".
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moneromooo
Pool owners wouldn't have to run another daemon, since merge mining's optional.
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moneromooo
There's the point of getting an advantage if you do run that other daemon, I guess.
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jwinterm
yes, that sums up the objections I think
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jwinterm
also that it makes mobile verification worse than already is because monero randomx is bit slower than tweaked random-wow I think
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moneromooo
Actually, the several daemon is a fair argument, since if we get a few dozen merge mined coins, monero pool owners will start not bothering anymore, so there'll be a "we get the best ones only" effect.
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hyc
what? they'll stop running fullnodes?
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hyc
relying on other peoples' nodes would increase their latency
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moneromooo
No. I meant that monero pool owners may start merge mining until we get lots of merge mined coins. Basically it doesn't scale.
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moneromooo
may use merge mining for the first few coins, but not after proliferation.
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hyc
maybe it should only be an incubation mechanism
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hyc
once a coin grows to some level, it stops merge mining and goes off on its own
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moneromooo
Unclear how to measure growth though. Number of blocks not attached to the parent chain ?
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jwinterm
hyc, I don't think that has ever happened in all of mining history
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hyc
we've already made mining history once, so?
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jwinterm
I'm just saying, history says that coins begin life merge mining or move over to merge mining
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jwinterm
I don't think I've ever heard of a coin "graduating" from merge mining to independent mining
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hyc
don't you find that puzzling?
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hyc
coins merge-mine because they're not strong enough to stand on their own
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hyc
that would seem to me to be more relevant when they're new, not after they've matured
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jwinterm
yea, I guess it just becomes a crutch and for the most part they fade into obscurity anyway
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jwinterm
namecoin, dogecoin, and rootstock are probably the only three of real note
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hyc
anyway, how many new coins would we expect to show up wanting to merge mine?
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hyc
per year, say
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moneromooo
I have a feeling once a few do it, there'll be a glut.
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sech1
guys
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sech1
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hyc
if we say "we can take on X coins at once, some existing coin must graduate out before new ones can be accepted"
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sech1
they are already here
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moneromooo
You don't really accept, unless you parse coinbase and whitelist.
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sech1
Monero can't really control who merge mines what otherwise it's not permissionless
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moneromooo
Any idea what this is about ? > This is slightly different than merged mining, in that BBP's blocks are now solved with an equation that prevents pre-image attacks.
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sech1
No idea
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sech1
that coin is... weird
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hyc
BiblePay. might as well go full literal on being a cult
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kinghat[m]
can coins merge mine on merged mined coins?
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moneromooo
I can't think of a reason against it.
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moneromooo
(a technical one)