irc working fine

.lenny

we're now back online

give it a go

Checking

Seems good!

wee

sorry for the downtime, had to do some things

Not a big deal! Just hard to know what's going on when the downtime is to your method of comms 😅

it's better to keep expectation slow

*expectations low

so when we exceed them, people are happy

irc still working

nioc mAh boi

meow

Hehe matrix is working now

Thanks rehrar

Good evening everyone. Is there anyone with the capability to add xmr support to the lamassu software? They are open source and could merge the effort easily. I would be giving / maintaining kyc free cash purchase of xmr at 16 locations in Maine. We are in the process of dropping general bytes hardware and software and replacing with lamassu, which currently does not support xmr. We could potentially offer

something for a bounty for this project, maybe half of our xmr sales profit from 2020.

* Good evening everyone. Is there anyone with the capability to add xmr support to the lamassu software? They are open source and could merge the effort easily. I would be giving / maintaining kyc free cash purchase of xmr at 16 locations in Maine. We are in the process of dropping general bytes hardware and software and replacing with lamassu, which currently does not support xmr. We could potentially offer

something for a bounty for this project.

I'm guessing you already asked Lamassu and they said no? Or they gave a price tag that was too high?

I asked if they were planning on doing it, they said no. I'm not going to push, my company doesn't profit enough off xmr to pay for it to be exclusive or anything. On the other hand it might be a good idea for the monero community to get it on lamassu BTMs. Obviously not every operator will add it, but there are over 600 of them installed right now. Maybe someone could name a price and the community could put

up a fund.

Unlike every other BTM manufacturer, lamassu is open source. It's probably not even a huge task to add it, and I'm fairly sure it would get merged upstream if it's stable.

do they support any coins other than bitcoin today?

oh yes they do. just found it in their faq

Short list of major coins. Xmr would fit into the list quite well.

monero does seem like a natural fit for atms

We've offered it for 3+ years. When we started the was only one other BTM in the United States that offered xmr. It wasn't very popular until 2020, it was the second most popular coin after BTC, we dropped dash LTC and doge last year from lack of sales, xmr was higher than all of those as well as eth. Now we only sell BTC xmr and eth. BTC accounts for something like 96% of all sales, so this has still

technically fringe, but it would be nice to have.

* We've offered it for 3+ years. When we started there was only one other BTM in the United States that offered xmr. It wasn't very popular until 2020, it was the second most popular coin after BTC, we dropped dash LTC and doge last year from lack of sales, xmr was higher than all of those as well as eth. Now we only sell BTC xmr and eth. BTC accounts for something like 96% of all sales, so this is still

technically fringe, but it would be nice to have.

If I had some time on my hands, I'd definitely do this

snowkeld[m]1: thank you for messaging us here about it :)

Can you put me in touch with someone who works there? justin⊙ms

You looking for contact to lamassu?

Looks like, yes.

<sgp_ "Can you put me in touch with som"> I have discussed development with them over support⊙li

snowkeld[m]1: awesome, can you please add me and help schedule some call?

We're glad you support XMR, seems like an obvious fit for ATMs

I don't like ATMs much. They have high fees and do KYC.

<fatcat[m] "I don't like ATMs much. They hav"> Not all ATMs have strict KYC.

In fact, ATMs have been my main non-KYC buying points for some time now.

You can find ones which only want SMS verification, which can be spoofed easily with textverified.com or similar services.

With regards to high fees: you are right. They have high fees and premiums. I guess that's the price you gotta pay for non-kyc bitcoins.

I see that monero.social matrix instance's rooms are publicly query-able now

I added that homeserver to my client to search for the public rooms in there.

joined there.

snowkeld[m]1: General Bytes ATMs have Monero support

sgp_: ^

In Ireland, we have quite a few around the place. XMR isn't enabled on most of them though

Software interfaces with Kraken for refills

They're trying to migrate to Lamassu. That is exactly what they said above. Lol.

rottenwheel: ah I see

Then ignore me

Why proposing migration?

Or is it just to get more compatible machines?

Not proposing. It's their business, their calls.

snowkeld[m]1: Perhaps wise to also open a thread on r/monero

More visibility there

<Hmm -_-> Hi guys! I want to ask you several questions: 1. Can I get balance in my wallet or perform some transactions with JSON RPC? 2. Exist some API to work with xmr wallet? 3. I was trying to use Web3 to work with wallet and use some public nodes but no luck with this. Need I some private node for this? (Check balance or perform transactions) Thanks in advance!

Think something in the config is wonky with monero.social, rehrar[m]

See how usernames show up?

sethsimmons: it's being bridged over freenode. The cause is open as an issue on github meta repo

Don't have the link rn

Thought that was being fixed during the downtime 😕

Guess it was some other issue

Yeah, I guess it's not fixed yet

hi there. if i send coins to changenow n they send me xmr, does the kyc exchange that i got coins from know about the xmr i get?

am i supposed to send coins to my wallet (only have xmr wallet from now) and then send to changenow for most privacy? thanks

runnin gui with full local node n vpn

<fatcat[m] "I don't like ATMs much. They hav"> We have no KYC limits. Any BTM in the US that forces KYC on every customer is doing so by choice, but requirement.

* We have no KYC limits. Any BTM in the US that forces KYC on every customer is doing so by choice, not requirement.

snowkeld[m]: is there a cutoff where you need ID?

The problem is that banks try to force businesses into stricter requirements. These are the ones for US MSBs, a couple states have stricter requirements.

* The problem is that banks try to force businesses into stricter requirements. These are the ones for US MSBs according to regulation, a couple states have stricter requirements.

Based on another user reporting, it looks like Tutanota accounts for monero.social should now also work as intended

What kind of person steals from their own community? www.reddit.com/r/Monero/comments/6d5yt5/what_fluffypony_just_did_is_not_ok/

what kind of person calls it stealing?

<netrik182[m] "Don't have the link rn"> I don't see a username funkiness individual issue filed in meta nor it listed among the issues in the mega Monero.social one: monero-project/meta #549

I'll add it.

rehrar[m]:

Just testing, sorry

I think the funkiness was just referring to matrix accounts on matrix.org also appearing as freenode accounts because of the bridge

I think it should resolve itself when we fix the other issues

What other issues? The two primary ones were receiving email and adding monerosocial to room searching which are both now fixed

xmrscott[m]1: most importantly, combining the rooms together

talking with mumuks rn to fix

Ok, cool :)

<midipoet "Why proposing migration?"> General Bytes owner promised me personally that their software would always be free and never require callback to general bytes. They did not hold up their end, the software is closed source and versions 2019 forward call back total sales to general bytes so they can charge for use of the server software (even when running it privately). The amount they charge is based on

sales volume. I won't give their company another penny for lying to me and not upholding it honorably. Lamassu is the only manufacturer that's open source, they deserve to be at the front, but unfortunately the vast majority of BTM operators do not care for crypto at all and are simply involved to extract fiat money profits and even use tools to minimize the exposure to crypto. These are the ones requiring kyc

for every purchase and looking for BTMs manufactured by companies that will hold their hand through every aspect of setup and operation and rely entirely on banking. My company is still unbanked because I wan't adopt "stricter than legally required" kyc.

is Lamassu german?

would be cool to get xmr support on there

Lamassu has original dev in New Hampshire I'm pretty sure. Manufacturing is in Portugal and the company is now listed as being in switzerland.

Just out of curiousity, if you're unbanked, doesn't that mean you end up with a boat load of cash that you can't do anything with? Are you buying crypto with physical cash to replinish the machines?

correct, we buy from our customers, and sell to customers.

but isn't most of the flow customers buying?

do you get much selling flow?

Flow depends on price. We offer over market rate to those selling to us, there are a few locals that simply buy on exchange and sell to us to profit on arb. I continue to search for banking, but I will not allow a bank to dictate how I operate, so it's been a tough search.

I have found some that would -if I wasn't reg as a MSB, which the company doesn't act as a MSB, but the feds basically said "fight us in court (maybe go to jail) or register" ironically, registering means we're less traceable by the feds 🤣 morons

interesting. thanks for the color. What a novel idea to pay above market prices to rebuy! :)

in my experience you'll have a hard time arguing that you're not an MSB, but more power to you

Yeah, that is quite clever.

Apart from the IRC chat that is

or maybe I misinterpretted. Are you saying you did register as an MSB even though you don't think you should be required to?

any OTC desks register with FinCEN as an MSB at the federal level out of an abundance of caution and to show the feds that they aren't trying to fly under the radar, but do not register with individual states because they are not doing money transmission. It's a lot harder to argue that an ATM provider is not doing money transmission

* many OTC desks register with FinCEN as an MSB at the federal level out of an abundance of caution and to show the feds that they aren't trying to fly under the radar, but do not register with individual states because they are not doing money transmission. It's a lot harder to argue that an ATM provider is not doing money transmission

"many OTC desks" not "any" (edited)

xmrscott yes, I was referring to the bridge stuff mentioned by sgp

I know a guy that got three personal bank accounts closed because he was operating ATMs and depositing 10s of thousands of dollars of physical cash at his local branches. Now has trouble getting any bank account for his personal use. So definitely don't do that ;). If you ever get a bank, keep business and personal separate.

(New to XMR and this chat, so lmk if this is the wrong place to ask) I've been interested in XMR for several years because of its privacy and b/c it seems to be built to stay truer to the original promise of cryptocurrency, but haven't invested previously. I want to buy some XMR (and plan to hold on to it for the long term) but it seems like the way to buy it anonymously is to convert ETH to Tornado Cash, then

send that to a separate anonymous wallet, and then trade that anonymized ETH for XMR somewhere. But the exchanges I've looked at (poloniex, binance...) all have legal terms that exclude US citizens and/or VPN use. Are there any options for anonymously buying XMR legally in the US (aside from local monero)? I don't quite understand uniswap and all the defi options yet. Or should I just not worry about the

Tornado anonymizing anyway? Not trying to do anything illegal, just privacy conscious. Thanks for any opinions/insight.

<Bananaboat> swapzone.io I just use DASH - less transaction fees than ETH..

<Bananaboat> no KYC needed ^

robshaftoe[m] so you have access to crypto already?

YOu can convert to XMR in Cake Wallet from many different crypto without kyc

<Bananaboat> I transfer fiat to crypto (DASH for example) then move my DASH off-exchange to a hardware wallet and from the hardware wallet I swap for XMR

Cake supports DASH to XMR

:)

you realize dash is not private at all?

<Bananaboat> thats why I swap for XMR..............

or ETH, BTC, BCH, ADA, NANO and others

<Bananaboat> lol

<Bananaboat> thats the point xD

right :)

lol

dash is just a vehicle

<Bananaboat> ^

robshaftoe[m] wanted to mix ETH

anyone member when DASH was worth fuck all?

and not named dash

so DASH is not an alternative to that

it had that stupid edgelord name

bananaboat is also a vehicle

LOL

is watercraft a vehicle?

Have you tried Cake Wallet?

jwinterm is technically correct

to convert?

<Bananaboat> yeah isnt mixing DASH basically the same as just converting to XMR? whats the point....

robshaftoe[m], tornado cash is a dumb idea

Wharrgarbl[m], darkcoin

<Bananaboat> you swap for XMR without KYC

and briefly xcoin

and an expensive dumb idea at that.

yeah darkcoin

edgelord af

<Bananaboat> you move DASH off exchange.. "gifted it"

<Bananaboat> "I lost it in a boating accident"

when most new crypto were threads on the btc forums :<

<Bananaboat> "someone stole my wallet"

banana boating accident

<Bananaboat> exchange has no idea where my DASH went...

Or just buy any crypto f2f

<Bananaboat> unless i swap directly from a KYC exchange xD

or using a non kyc atm

only issue with atms is the insane fees

<Bananaboat> yeah if you wanna pay those fees lol

<Bananaboat> you can setup a localmonero "SELL" order to buy monero near spot-price.

<Bananaboat> dont go to the "BUY" section.

tru

y not

<Bananaboat> 6%+ fee if you fill a "BUY" offer vs just create a "SELL" offer near spot price and some other guy will sell his XMR to you

thanks for the head's up

<ComplyLast "rob.shaftoe, tornado cash is a d"> ComplyLast: yeah I have some BTC and ETH. Why specifically is Tornado dumb? I'm not familiar with it but I read a post on using it to transfer ETH to XMR. Just trying to understand the options and implications. Thanks for the replies.

tornado cash is very expensive afaik

so you want to hide the fact that you're exchanging eth for something?

<robshaftoe[m] "ComplyLast: yeah I have some BTC"> teddit.novalue.us/r/Monero/comments…thoughts_on_tornado_cash/fs9px0i/#c

Those are my thoughts on the issue.

sure sethsimmons

so if op is doing x-> tornardo -> x (minus fees) -> monero

he is not accomplishing much and just spending money on fees

Yes, would not recommend using it at all, especially not right now.

if you want to hide the fact that you're converting ETH to Monero

<ComplyLast "so you want to hide the fact tha"> Not necessarily, I was just thinking that since the point of XMR is anonymity/privacy (among others), you have to consider the entry and exit points... I guess there's no need to pre-anonymize it, just exchange for XMR?

The trail ends once you have XMR -- if you bought the Eth with KYC they can easily trace it to the swap for Eth

robshaftoe[m], unless you have a very specific threat model that seems like the most convenient way to do it

So they may know you have swapped for XMR depending on what service you want, but thats fine for most people.

Ok. thanks for the replies.

also

BTC - > XMR might give you better privacy

Is there a consensus on the safest/most trustworthy ways to exchange for XMR? There are a lot of options listed on getmonero.org, but I've seen some skeptical posts about some, and I'm not familiar with most.

depending on how you manage your UTXOs, etc

<robshaftoe[m] "Is there a consensus on the safe"> This is one I've heard good things about but haven't used myself: sideshift.ai/eth/xmr

robshaftoe[m], without KYC you man?

*mean?

Could also do it on Kraken if you're comfortable with KYC

bisq, changenow, sideshift, morphtoken

etc

<rupee[m]1 "or maybe I misinterpretted. Are "> The company does not facilitate transfer. It does not "buy for the customer" it sells coins that it invested in. I started the company to further my investment position in BTC. Anyway, yes, reg with feds, not with state. Feds threatened, state does not require. Been working on legal rebuttal to feds for quite some time, but I'm not interested in pursing it in

court, it's just not worth it. Reg or not it's a profitable business and it's not worth the risk.

snowkeld[m]1, do you offer monero?

<rupee[m]1 "I know a guy that got three pers"> No, don't do this. AFAIK my company is the largest without banking in the BTM industry in the US or Canada. I've been doing this for 5 years, we have 16 BTM locations now. It's a well oiled machine :) I haven't shared any secrets, mostly you could only compete by having years in the industry with hundreds of contacts that trust you absolutely. Maybe it's a unicorn

of a company 🤷‍♂️

good luck snowkeld[m]1

that's awesome

<ComplyLast "etc"> Cake wallet?

you seem to be doing god's work snowkeld[m]1

vikrants[m], sure that too

snowkeld[m]1: where are these BTMs

<ComplyLast "snowkeld, do you offer monero?"> Yes, at locations still using General Bytes. I entered this chat looking for anyone wanting to work towards XMR support on Lamassu because we are switching to that.

never pops my mind because I've never used it vikrants[m] nothing against it

<nioc "snowkeld: where are these BTMs"> Maine, USA

<ComplyLast "never pops my mind because I've "> we do thousands of conversions to XMR on a DAILY basis

> <@freenode_nioc:matrix.org> snowkeld: where are these BTMs

* Maine, USA

btcmaine.com

Thx

vikrants[m], I think you're doing great work, nothing against it

As i said, never used your wallet, so it's not top of mind for me

sure sure.. not biggie.. i just wanted new comers to know

Cakewallet is super cool guys! It has my blessing

ComplyLast and sethsimmons thanks for the info 👍️

<Bananaboat> they can trace it to a swap but they dont know "who" swapped it, if it has moved to a new wallet off-exchange.

awwwww..thanks

vikrants[m] I'm a old dog, too old for new tricks, so I'm still rocking monerujo

also you guys need fdroid (soon tm) for me to try it out :P

understood.. the message was for new comers asking the questions

<ComplyLast "also you guys need fdroid (soon "> Yessssss F-Droid or at least signed APKs

fdroid within 2 weeks

I will be able to try it then

but I have been recommending it for my iOS friends for ages

awesome.. thanks

<vikrants[m] "fdroid within 2 weeks"> Finally. Been so long.

<rottenwheel "Finally. Been so long. "> what?? only 2 years!! :)

and another thing... we will be replacing the xmrto feature of fixed bitcoin this week with another solution, so stay tuned.

can we also get monerujo update supporting orbot in two weeks? :)

<ComplyLast "also you guys need fdroid (soon "> In case you don't want to use the main fdroid repository for security reasons, you can create your own fdroid repository. Software is open source and easy to set up.

vikrants[m]: Monerujo does it this way for example

<mechanic41turk[m] "can we also get monerujo update "> I'll check about that

wat is this matrix "sent a long message" bs

lol

<Mumuks[m] "vikrants[m]: Monerujo does it th"> Thanks

<nioc "wat is this matrix "sent a long "> Pleb

just speak

nioc: pleb

so the monero.social rooms are in the process of transitioning to the new rooms.

<mechanic41turk[m "can we also get monerujo update "> anhdres[m]

any time schedule on that?

sorry your message was truncated

nioc: get on to the new century so you can see all messages

<rottenwheel "anhdres[m] "> yeah, he replied.

future is matrix, old man.

<mechanic41turk[m "future is matrix, old man."> Thou shall not mess with coin.

no, the future is something else :)

Coin based, turk not based.

<rottenwheel "Thou shall not mess with coin. "> gtfo bitcoiner

Lol.

<vikrants[m] "fdroid within 2 weeks"> Awesome, we settled on new recommendations for customers only last week, including cake. I will be on the looking for fdroid and be sure to add link to there as well.

;)

<mechanic41turk[m "so the monero.social rooms are i"> sgp_: ^

xmrscott: yes, I just either need admin on the matrix.org rooms or cooperation from those who are

the mechanical turk was a lie!

#monero-markets is already transitioned in addition to #monero-space, #monero-mrw, and #monero-support

also #monero-policy

sgp_: so you mean, those rooms are natively federated with the matrix.org rooms, and then (only once) relayed into IRC?

mechanic41turk: for those channels, yes!

sounds great!

as it should be

yeah, lesson learned there

haha

learning pains

Not seeing -support, but maybe it takes a while to propagate

weird lol

I am seeing support room

@snowkeld:chat.btcmaine.com: Just to mention it in case it hadn't cross your mind, i know a few BTM operators wrote their own firmware and in some cases they license it out to other operators. Don't know if they did it for Generaly Bytes machines or not and doubt they added monero support in their custom builds, but might be worth exploring. Regardless I think the community should explore the work required and

trying to get some volunteers or a community funding proposal to get it done on Lamassu because from what you've said Lamassu sounds like good company/product

need to change the main address but it should show up

main address changed

xmrscott: should work now; the default address was matrix.org not monero.social (that is now fixed)

Yeah, just saw that

Yep, can confirm it now shows up

can confirm the address is changed to monero.social

snowkeld[m]1: Did you see my msg regarding posting on reddit?

<dEBRUYNE "snowkeld: Did you see my msg reg"> I did. I think I'm getting something started now and might be good to get a post as soon as a project starts, then others can have a place to directly contribute

Cheater.

I mostly get "Connection failed" with the WiFi symbols to the right of the node list already being crossed over.

Occasionally I get to connect some clearnet nodes -- and during those times, yes, it works.

how do I birdge a matrix room to discord?

apparently via irc

x[m]: there is a matrix discord bridge, but I've never used it

<sgp> Discord <[justin_server]> IRC <[matrix_bot]> Matrix

x[m]: github.com/Half-Shot/matrix-appservice-discord

<sgp> haha, keep the circle going in an infinite loop

<mechanic41turk[m] "I mostly get "Connection failed""> We'll soon tweak that, it's due to Monerujo's timeout for nodes, which under tor is proving to be too strict

sethsimmons: twitter.com/_Checkmatey_/status/1361605389091889152?s=19

Wish they would do Monero

I think we mostly need a clearer contact method for Monero. A landing page for how to contact people in the community on getmonero.org

They posted on r/monero and got a ton of feedback and suggested interviewees

They just did nothing after that (so far at least_

hmm really? I may be mixing things up then

sgp_: actually, would it be viable for monero.social to host the discord matrix bridge? I think it gives individual users to each discord user as opposed to the irc discord one

are there resources which explain things short and maby graphically? like the fiat onramp

fiat onramp to xmr? localmonero, ATMs, Dex (bisq), cex ( kraken, binance, poloniex etc), via other crypto (tradeogre, kucoin, morphtoken, cake wallet +++)

Mumuks[m]: I'm open to ideas

sgp_: I'm not sure how is the monero.social computer infrastructure, but I doubt the not needs a lot of resources

The github page has the instructions and there is #discord:half-shot.uk for doubts

The guy that writes it is the same guy that writes the irc matrix bridge and he is respinsive

+Inge- yes, that's not an explanation/illustration a noob will understand

"It can't be a gangster asset" pscp.tv/w/cvrLG3R3LTI2NDc5MTYwfDFnc…vHgi4rApjHuA9KDbGsV0u1FQZung==?s=09

hugh hendry and Raoul Pal on btc

lol

DatBotXMR sent a long message

<Bananaboat> question

<Bananaboat> if Monero went up to 40k$ one day like bitcoin would transaction cost the same amount of XMR?

<Bananaboat> oh wait

<Bananaboat> nvm

<Bananaboat> its still cheap af

<Bananaboat> >_>

lol, "DatBotXMR"

Bloody hell.

ErCiccione xmrscott[m]1 Mumuks[m] questions about the Matrix rooms since ErCiccione has some concerns and it would be good to fully understand

at the moment, if there's an existing matrix.org room, I am adding that to monero.social also

but the long room ID still is !a:matrix.org

is that an issue?

as i explained privately and on the github issue. That way the room will be still hosted on matrix.org, you want it to be hosted on the monero.social server

is there any practical difference if one is the backup?

Yes. We are still relaying on matrix's infrastructure instead of our own, as it should be.

ErCiccione: blog.alexgleason.me/matrix-outages

"Matrix is a decentralized instant-messaging platform. While user accounts are tied to a single homeserver, rooms aren't."

"Since rooms are synced between homeservers, you can make other homeservers aware of your rooms. This will make the rooms sync, providing redundancy and a backup in case matrix.org goes down."

for practical reasons then, I don't care if the room was originally created on matrix.org

basically each server hosted the same room separately and syncs up it seems

yes, as it's saying "providing redundancy and a backup in case matrix.org goes down.". If you don't mind, that's your call. The important is that there aren't duplicated rooms anymore

imo, the benefit of starting the room brand new on monero.social is basically 0 and the cons of migrating more people over are greater

where we don't have equivalent matrix.org rooms however I've been making them initially in monero.social

this is the only major case where I see the legacy full room identifier usercontent.irccloud-cdn.com/file/SoKWkOuh/fullID

the only argument I can really think of is that the old tombstone rooms need to go to the full link, so someone who is trying to upgrade rooms *may* not be able to if matrix.org is down. That's a guess though

yeah i understand that. That's why i suggested two approaches and the one you chose is the second of the two, which is fine (monero-project/meta #549#issuecomment-775045232)

where we don't have equivalent matrix.org rooms however I've been making them initially in monero.social <- yes, that's the correct approach

okay, I'll basically pick and choose which to be the native room based on whether there is an existing matrix.org room with users then

perfect 👍

yes. If there isn't already a matrix room one should be created, otherwise the monero.social address should be added

yup :)

(Amd made primary as I understand it)

yeah I'll make monero.social primary in all cases

Yes, that's good

ErCiccione: want me to do the #monero-research-lab migration?

I have a monero.social account, i can do it tomorrow or i can give you powers and you do it

you can just add sgp_:moenro.social as admin without a monero.social account

*sgp_:monero.social

i mean i have a monero.social account that i used to add the address for the rooms i administrate, but ok. I'm giving you admin powers there

luigi1111w: can you give me mod here temporarily to bridge this room to the other matrix server?