02:22:48 https://cointelegraph.com/news/privacy-coins-pose-less-risk-of-money-laundering-than-other-coins 02:23:02 thoughts on that one sarang? 04:52:48 is that title ... literally true? 04:53:43 ah, there is a subtext to that statement "... when considering evidence of illicit use in practice" 05:57:36 Forgive my tears of joy rbrunner 05:57:49 Or rbrunner7, I think you're here via mattermost? 05:57:55 https://www.reddit.com/r/Monero/comments/iteivi/rehrar_transparency_report/g5g2aaw 05:57:56 [REDDIT] rehrar transparency report (self.Monero) | 2 points (54.0%) | 18 comments | Posted by Rehrar | Created at 2020-09-15 - 18:26:43 06:17:47 Yeah, here on Mattermost I am "rbrunner7", while directly on IRC simply "rbrunner". Somewhat historical reasons. 06:18:31 You are welcome, and I do think you certainly do not deserve some of the comments that were made there. 06:57:15 Well, I had a feeling that the "with their own money" part wasn't going to fly under the radar. :) 07:02:40 yeah. I really dislike the notion core team money == their personal fund 07:04:54 As i said in my comment i'm also very concerned about the fact that the general fund will be empty soon and core doesn't seem to have a plan to not let that happen. I offered some mitigations but never heard an answer from them. 07:06:03 We are lucky that now tari and globee take care of most of the expenses, but if that changes for any reason we are fucked. and the general fund has no income reguardless tho 07:09:20 ErCiccione: you are incorrect. Core does not manage this money on behalf of the community. Management implies that at any time, the original giver can take it back. If I manage the money for my cousin, they can come and ask me not to manage it anymore, or give them what I have. 07:09:55 This doesn't happen with core. Core cannot give this money back to the original donors. The donors have entrusted this money to core. It is theirs to spend as they please. 07:11:06 So rbrunner7 was correct. 07:11:35 I don't see it that way. People give those money to core to use for the development of Monero. That doesn't mean they should spend it as they please. Sure they could since those money are donated, but that doesn't mean it's part of the "social contract" they have with the community 07:12:00 An example that helps to clear this up. What happens if the community decides core is "mismanaging" this money? Their only option is not to donate further. They have no way of getting any donated money back. 07:13:24 again. i don't think that the fact that people cannot have their money back means that core has their personal money. Those are funds of the community and should be treated as such. of course the only choice the community has is to not donate further, but that doesn't change the reason why they have those money. 07:13:40 I think it's an important distinction to make. It let's people know the actual extent of the trust they are giving core when they donate. 07:14:38 It is not funds of the community. It is funds used FOR the community, and FROM the community. But it is not the community's funds. 07:15:27 If this rubs people the wrong way, then they are free not to donate. It is indeed more power and trust given to core than most realize. 07:16:29 In a sense, this is why the CCS was created to begin with. To give an alternative to "trust core completely". It lessens that to "trust core as arbiters". It's also why the CCS has more written rules about its use. 07:17:34 It is an important distinction. If core thinks the general fund is their personal treasory i invite them to declare it as such, because personally i consider the general fund a fund made of community money that they are entrusted to manage 07:17:38 Now, all this to say, core has done a decent job so far of using the GF for what they think are uses of furthering Monero and in the community's best interests, but that's neither here nor there if someone doesn't like the trust model. 07:25:17 The reason I say that last part is because I believe that if the community and core had a disagreement, that core would bend their knee to the community. This is because of their role as stewards of the project, which they take seriously. 07:28:26 I think that a clarification from core is needed. I remember the general fund being advertised as "a fund for paying infrastructure and unexpected expenses". Now the fund is not serving that purpose, but for paying a community member for his work. I think this plus the fact that this expense wasn't made public until years later is the reason why the community is not taking this report well. And i cannot blame 07:28:26 them. 07:29:11 Important: my point is not related to the actual value of rehrar's work, only about management/transparency of the general fund 07:30:28 Though maybe it's time that you do make a statement on your perception on the value of my work. You are a very trusted community member after all. 07:30:57 Too many of these "I'm not saying anything about rehrar" things. The broader issue needs resolution, yes, but so does the immediate one. 07:32:00 Maybe it's time for me to be done? Maybe not? Who knows. Core can't act on community sentiment if community never gives it about specific issues. 07:33:06 There's a lot of complaints recently that core doesn't act on community will, when there's very little discussion about immediate issues, only about broader ones. Test their mettle. See if they actually respond to community will by giving telling it to them. :D 07:33:39 I realize I'd do much better by keeping my head down and letting this blow over as most things do, but perhaps that's not as valuable as getting honest feedback. 07:36:32 I think you are missing the point. For how i see it the issue is not about the content of your work, but it's about the management of the general fund That's why i always left that aside. Personally i think that using the general fund to pay a salary without having a plan for when the fund will be empty is quite insane and doomed to create a lot of controversies. That's the immediate problem that needs a 07:36:33 solution. 07:37:11 There's a lot of complaints recently that core doesn't act on community will <- what are you referring to rehrar? 07:37:55 Question on that then. I was working on a thing to give GF some income (albeit it wouldn't be much if at all) in Monero FM. And yet your recent reddit comment says that you don't think I should count that as hours because of conflict of interest. 07:38:40 So now I'm in a catch22. I can't work on getting the GF more money, but if the GF doesn't have consistent income then paying my salary is insane and doomed. 07:38:51 So who will work on getting the GF money? 07:39:31 Yes, it's an ambiguity of course. 07:40:25 Because in any case when you will work for filling the community fund can be seen as a conflict of interest. I'm not blaming you for that, merely pointing out the fragility and forced ambiguity of your position 07:40:44 That's why it's important that core comes out for a plan to deal with this situation 07:40:51 *with a plan 07:41:10 I see. Well I'll pass this along and make sure it comes to their attention. 07:41:53 I hope they are reading these conversations tho, it's quite an important matter 07:42:52 I'll do my best to make sure they do. 07:43:26 Anyways. Almost 2AM here. Off to bed. Night! 07:43:49 good night! 08:00:07 is it ajs who made the "Community & Key Aspects" monero video? i don't recall 08:45:02 i helped out with writing the script 08:46:04 Got it. Do you know where i can find the original video? so we can upload it to getmonero 08:48:23 freenode_ajs_[m] ^ 08:49:54 savandra has the originals 08:50:30 https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCnjUpT9gGxyQ_lud7uKoTCg 08:50:30 [ Monero - YouTube ] - www.youtube.com 08:50:44 Do you know how i can contact them? 08:54:46 Is it me or did Monero FM get merged with barely any discussion? 08:55:24 https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCnjUpT9gGxyQ_lud7uKoTCg/about 08:55:25 [ Monero - YouTube ] - www.youtube.com 08:56:32 I emailed him last year about transferring the channel and getting the originals of all the explainer videos, but he didn't respond. 09:05:27 freenode_ajs_[m]: Yeah i remember writing him at that email address long time ago and didn't get any answer. i managed to contact him somehow but don't remember how :/ 09:06:22 selsta: Was merged quite quickly. The people who commented seemed to agrree about moving it to funding required, but yeah i see your point. Would have probably been better to wait a bit more. 09:09:02 I still have questions, e.g. is rehrar going to use core team paid time to be DJ? 09:11:28 If he goes to Monero world tour as a DJ, why not? 09:15:35 ErCiccione: btw still not a fan of translating the user guides 09:15:46 some information there is super niche or outdated 09:16:34 e.g. I would remove https://www.getmonero.org/resources/user-guides/How-to-mine-Monero-XMR-without-a-mining-equipment.html 09:16:49 no reason to advertise nicehash 09:17:19 a lot of guides are obsolete with your GUI guide 09:18:41 I understand. The work on translating the guides has been ongoing for some time and now there are 3 people working on those. We can remove the guides we think are not useful (i agree about the nicehash one), but i don't think the GUI guide replaces aimed single user guides 09:19:01 I don’t see why we should maintain duplicated infomation. 09:19:05 information* 09:19:18 we already fail to maintain the guides we have 09:19:25 (not directed at you) 09:19:31 maintaining stuff is difficult 09:20:14 https://www.getmonero.org/resources/user-guides/Offline_Backup.html 09:20:24 this also seems quite outdated unless I don’t understand what this is 09:22:00 https://www.getmonero.org/resources/user-guides/multisig-messaging-system.html 09:22:16 You mean you would remove the user guides and point people to the GUI guide instead? let me say that nobody ever maintained the guides, so yeah, they are all sort of outdated in the terminology. I updated the super outdated ones, but they would all need a refresh 09:22:27 yes 09:22:45 https://www.getmonero.org/resources/user-guides/Offline_Backup.html -> the content of this should be still good. The terminology is outdatred i agree 09:23:08 i think we need to have a much wider and deeper discussion if we want to remove the user guides (i disagree) and halt the work of translators 09:23:59 https://www.getmonero.org/resources/user-guides/multisig-messaging-system.html 09:24:16 Also, rating89us (i definitely mispelled their nick) is currently working on updating those guides 09:24:21 this one also, rbunner might say more but monero multisig is quite in early stages and might change a lot, don’t know if it is worth it to translate those 09:24:54 and is planning of adding new ones 09:25:28 mmh, i see. That guide is been up for a long time, so it's already translated in some languages and yeah, translators are working on it 09:25:59 I just worry that it is not worth the effort translators put into. 09:26:08 I see more value in e.g. the GUI, or basic website stuff 09:26:49 I see your point. I can ask translators to not translate some guides if we want, but that would create problems with those who have CCS proposals related to those guides 09:27:09 The same way I think CLI is not worth translating 09:27:51 The difference is that i already tell translators to not work on CLI stuff unless they are bored and have nothing to do. The CLI is also currently locked on weblate 09:27:58 ok 09:28:24 yea I would do similar for the guides until we have them updated / removed the useless ones 09:29:27 I see and i agree, but i don't think this should effect the ongoing CCS proposals. 09:30:21 fwiw the user guides and the moneropedia are always the last things i tell people to translate. I will just ask to not translate the user guides until we have figured out how to act about that (as i said, excluding already ongoing CCS proposals) 09:30:35 ok 09:43:31 yea https://www.getmonero.org/resources/user-guides/Offline_Backup.html still looks good, the dependency part could be removed 09:45:03 let's move this to #monero-site :) 14:22:30 Selsta no I wouldn't get paid to DJ. There's a lot of one-time work that would need to get done, like taking our video content and turning it took audio content. 14:23:17 But that only needs to be done once per video. Besides that there's monthly reports on songs that need to get done and set in to be in compliance. 14:23:31 And a few other administrative like tasks. 14:24:05 As for song selection, for the most part it will be chosen automatically. If I do DJ an hour or so, rest assured, it will be on my own time. 15:16:26 Hi everyone - we've updated the CCS proposal to include some first feedback such as including a non-technical paragraph for end-users. https://repo.getmonero.org/monero-project/ccs-proposals/-/merge_requests/168 15:17:32 Can you paste that specific paragraph in a gist or pastebin? Doesn't seem to be an easy diff 15:18:10 Is that ok? https://repo.getmonero.org/monero-project/ccs-proposals/-/merge_requests/168/diffs?diff_id=2161&start_sha=54f6580c2aa765c5005e3d361f7ed1da9e0717ec 15:18:53 Oh that's right, it's also in the actual commits :) 15:18:54 thanks 17:37:07 Hi guys, can somebody explain me plz, what is "Adrress Monero starting with 5"? 17:37:11 https://home.treasury.gov/policy-issues/financial-sanctions/recent-actions/20200916 17:39:55 stagenet lol 17:40:12 0xd882cfc20f52f2599d84b8e8d58c7fb62cfe344b; Digital Currency Address - XMR 17:40:27 the 5 is LTC 17:40:28 Lol i think that stagenet start with 9 17:41:18 the one that starts with 5 is LTC 17:41:31 the xmr address is not an address lol 17:42:09 no, i think they refer to Monero 17:42:26 If only there were a way to display tabular data in HTML 17:42:31 some kind of... table 17:42:39 they must have copypasta'd wrong or something 17:42:44 it's only 64 char 17:42:50 I think so 17:43:05 so I'm wrong again 17:43:23 you guys should be used to that 17:43:42 Sooooo are they claiming that a stagenet address is somehow restricted/flagged? 17:43:53 no it's not a valid xmr address 17:44:00 unless there's some short form address I'm unaware of 17:46:38 Or if they flagged some representation of a tx or output 17:46:48 Which is also not really useful 17:48:02 Yeah that is a stealth address right? 17:48:23 Or whatever we are calling them these days 17:48:26 maybe it is a payent id 17:48:34 payment ids old style are 64 char 17:48:36 I believe 17:49:02 hm that sounds right 17:49:13 but lol at that then 17:49:24 Clearly their A-team is working on that address list 17:49:40 it's cleartext in the blockchain, so I guess you could find all txns with that payment ID 17:52:48 Mmm any way, is amsl not useful 17:58:33 That's like banning an arbitrary string for reference for bank transfers 17:58:51 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Illegal_number 17:58:51 [WIKIPEDIA] Illegal number | "An illegal number is a number that represents information which is illegal to possess, utter, propagate, or otherwise transmit in some legal jurisdiction. Any piece of digital information is representable as a number; consequently, if communicating a specific set of information is illegal in some way..." 17:59:26 What is the shortest illegal number? 18:00:15 its a trap, dont do it 18:01:08 420.69 18:14:41 zkao: how can I know to avoid it, if I don't know what it is? 20:43:29 say what, illegal number. 20:43:59 i suppose some words, and hence their sounds have been banned in the past 20:44:15 their sounds == how they sound when spoken 20:54:40 midipoet: The one I know of is the one used for DVD copy protection in America 20:54:52 Because having it is technically in violation of a patent or some other similar bs 22:03:02 kayabanerve yeah 09-f9-11-02-9d-74-e3-5b-d8-41-56-c5-63-56-88-c0 22:06:13 needmoney90: imagine forcing a friend to have illegal content on their computer :( 22:06:49 Definitely not like Ubuntu's default install includes it in a package without the technical legal licensing anyways 22:07:42 after the debacle in 2007 about muh speech freedoms, that string is as good as public anyways. No one's gonna prosecute for it anymore. 22:08:00 Still funny to call it an illegal number and then post it tho :p 22:22:20 i wonder does anybody have it tattooed on themselves/a private part 22:22:36 o_0 22:24:13 https://www.geekytattoos.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/12/aacs-tattoo.jpg 22:24:25 semi-private? 22:24:38 depends how puritanical you are I guess 22:30:02 .usd 22:30:02 Monero price in USD = $88.33 22:30:09 Ick! 22:30:16 monerobux! 22:30:16 rehrar! 22:30:42 Erciccione if you ever don't k ow what your name is, just shout monerobux! 22:31:11 don't shout 22:31:17 just exclaim 22:39:16 jwinterm: outstanding! 22:39:57 :P 22:39:58 it's not me 23:13:49 This is quite incorrect: https://cointelegraph.com/news/new-us-treasury-sanctions-on-russian-hackers-hit-monero-address 23:13:55 (a) that's not a Monero address 23:14:05 (b) that list includes other assets besides Monero 23:17:34 I emailed the author of the article 23:26:30 lol what a trash article 23:37:50 Treasury sanctions Monero addresses (payment IDs)! (and other asset addresses)