16:27:14 <rehrar> half an hour to community meeting
16:37:00 <msvb-lab> rehrar: If you didn't reject the request, there is still a agenda entry missing (xmrscott put the text in the ticket.)
16:38:11 <rehrar> sure we'll discuss it
17:00:08 <rehrar> hi
17:00:13 <rehrar> Let's start our very important meeting.
17:00:18 <rehrar> 1. Gettings
17:00:21 <rehrar> *Greetings :P
17:00:43 <msvb-lab> Hello.
17:00:58 <ArticMine> Hi
17:01:39 <xmrscott[m]> osu
17:02:18 <rehrar> 2. MCW updates
17:02:34 <rehrar> Nothing much. Just a reminder that needmoney90 and sgp_ stepped down from leadership.
17:02:41 <rehrar> And if someone knows how to deop them for good plz tell me. :D
17:03:01 <rehrar> cuz everytime they reenter the room they get opped by default
17:03:29 <ErCiccione[m]> should be something something -O
17:03:35 <ErCiccione[m]> with capital O
17:03:37 <rehrar> something something -O
17:03:38 <rehrar> didn't work
17:03:56 <ErCiccione[m]> That's unexpected
17:03:59 <rehrar> I googled and all of the "IRC cheat sheet" stuff didn't work on freenode
17:03:59 <msvb-lab> I'm curious if they published reasons for their resignation? Was it here in IRC or Mattermost, Discord, Reddit, Facebook?
17:04:13 <rehrar> msvb-lab: it was a whole thing.
17:04:20 <ErCiccione[m]> i think it's a chanserv command, but i don't remember it now
17:04:34 <rehrar> Took a week of time and many comrades were lost to the horrors of war
17:04:45 <rehrar> but fr, I can fill you in later
17:04:46 <msvb-lab> I tried to find information, but failed. It's okay, just a curiosity.
17:04:53 <msvb-lab> Okay thanks.
17:04:54 <rehrar> 3. CCS updates
17:05:08 <rehrar> Let's play a game. Merge or don't merge.
17:05:11 <rehrar> https://repo.getmonero.org/monero-project/ccs-proposals/-/merge_requests/162
17:05:25 <rehrar> Merge or don't merge? Spanish localization proposal for the Monero Community by lh1008[m]
17:06:08 <rehrar> feel free to take some time to look over the proposal
17:06:18 <ErCiccione[m]> I'll be honest, i didn't understand what he was talking about most of the time 😛 but he has been working with spanish translations for some time now, so it's merge for me
17:06:38 <dsc_> /msg chanserv access #monero-community LIST
17:06:46 <dsc_> /msg chanserv access help
17:07:11 <dsc_> You're Welcome. </debruyne> :-P
17:07:20 <rehrar> and lh1008[m] if you're here you can speak a bit about it
17:07:44 <dEBRUYNE> :-P
17:07:59 <dEBRUYNE> Not using the capital letters is blasphemy though
17:08:03 <dsc_> True.
17:10:11 <rehrar> hmmmm...I think I did it. Thanks.
17:10:26 <rehrar> sgp_ and/or needmoney90 plz leave and return and we'll see if the problem is taken care of
17:10:29 <rehrar> anyways, back to CCS.
17:10:43 <rehrar> Merge or not merge? https://repo.getmonero.org/monero-project/ccs-proposals/-/merge_requests/159
17:10:53 <rehrar> Create Monero educational content in Spanish  by Lovera[m]
17:11:10 <rehrar> how much overlap is between these two I wonder?
17:12:19 <rehrar> Also this other Norwegian one while we're at it. https://repo.getmonero.org/monero-project/ccs-proposals/-/merge_requests/160
17:12:42 <rehrar> luigi1111: you here?
17:13:40 <rehrar> lol, ok. Community doesn't have much to say about these. I'll encourage the people to make reddit posts so we can try to get a few more opinions
17:13:46 <rehrar> We can move on to workgroup reports then.
17:13:57 <rehrar>  a. Daemon/CLI/GUI workgroup
17:14:05 <rehrar> dsc_ you can't pretend you're not here since you said something
17:14:17 <dsc_> I mean I can complain about how I don't think translations are not that important
17:14:23 <dsc_> but then everyone gets mad at me
17:14:25 <dsc_> :(
17:14:36 <rehrar> I mean report on GUI :P
17:14:47 <rehrar> or other things. selsta dEBRUYNE too
17:14:54 <dsc_> these proposals look fine as far as I can tell BTW
17:14:58 <ErCiccione[m]> I say merge for !160
17:15:32 <selsta> rehrar: socks5 proxy support and protable mode is currently worked on
17:15:33 <dsc_> Well I have a bunch of stuff to upstream into api_wallet and libwalletqt
17:16:14 <ErCiccione[m]> I'm not a fan of the fact that people started to make proposals for 6 months of work
17:16:15 <selsta> Also we want to update testnet to CLSAG soon
17:16:32 <dsc_> ErCiccione[m]: which one?
17:16:54 <ErCiccione[m]> "Create Monero educational content in Spanish"
17:17:16 <dsc_> Ah, I just looked at the amount, which seemed reasonable
17:17:26 <ErCiccione[m]> i wouldn't merge it in the present state, but i would ask to reduce to three months
17:17:39 <rehrar> soon we'll be fielding six year requests
17:17:51 <rehrar> also, selsta thanks for the update
17:18:05 <rehrar>  b. Localization workgroup
17:18:09 <rehrar> anything anywhere?
17:18:16 <ErCiccione[m]> I mean, a first CCS that ask funds for 6 months of work? nah. Contributors who have been funded through ccs for years still go with a proposal every 3 months for a reason
17:18:22 <lh1008[m]> Hey everyone
17:18:27 <lh1008[m]> I think I'm a bit late
17:18:29 <dsc_> ErCiccione[m]: agreed
17:18:32 <rehrar> you are
17:18:59 <lh1008[m]> Sorry
17:19:42 <rehrar> no worries
17:19:46 <rehrar> any comments about your proposal?
17:20:20 <lh1008[m]> Well, any questions? I'll give a small summary
17:20:53 <dsc_> Regarding my GUI CCS proposal (it has still 2 milestones left), I plan on creating another CCS for finishing my new project and upstreaming changes, using the remaining funds from the old CCS
17:21:25 <rehrar> dsc_: interesting
17:21:31 <rehrar> I'd be on board
17:21:36 <lh1008[m]> Inside the Monero Outreach we have been working a compensation model, and the proposal follows that compensation model. 0.1 XMR for 1000 translated words, and 0.025 XMR for 1000 words reviewed.
17:21:45 <dsc_> It's kind of a weird situation but I believe my time would be better spent on this new thing, even though that sounds pretty biased :P
17:22:14 <dsc_> But if people don't think that's a good idea I can finish my Monero GUI and delay my own project
17:22:20 <rehrar> lh1008[m]: I don't think anyone has an issue with your proposal. Pretty positive. I expect it to be merged soon, but that's just me.
17:22:30 <rehrar> dsc_: let's discuss that for a bit
17:22:40 <rehrar> can you give a brief summary as to why you think your time is better spent on your new project?
17:23:15 <dsc_> I don't consider my work on the official GUI as impactful as that what I'm working on, in terms of benefits for the community
17:23:25 <rehrar> aight
17:23:31 <rehrar> does anyone have questions for dsc_ regarding this? comments?
17:23:38 <dsc_> It's kind of hard to take my words at face value I suppose
17:23:54 <lh1008[m]> Okay, that'll be cool. The idea is to start as soon as possible. September I was thinking. So if it's merges I'll start on Tuesday. Thank you rehrar and everyone that read the proposal.
17:24:04 <dsc_> Perhaps such action should go with an opening the code up
17:24:14 <xmrscott[m]> Agree it's kinda hard to quantify, but the reaction to the demos has been quite positive I'd say
17:24:28 <dsc_> It has!
17:24:53 <rehrar> dsc_: I think open code is an obvious prerequisite
17:25:16 <dsc_> Yeah.. was planning on closed source and partnering with chainanalysis
17:25:21 <dsc_> guess I can kiss that idea goodbye
17:25:24 <xmrscott[m]> I agree though, I think the current GUI is relatively hardened, and building a new thing is likely to provide more value
17:25:53 <xmrscott[m]> (Unless the remaining milestones involve super notable improvements to TAILS or what have you where I suspect many the active users are)
17:26:59 <dsc_> xmrscott[m]: what kind of improvemets?
17:27:25 <xmrscott[m]> Quality of life improvements like the ones you worked on with with someone from the community
17:27:50 <dsc_> https://github.com/monero-project/monero-gui/pull/3016 like that one, yeah
17:28:03 <dsc_> We upstream such stuff to the GUI
17:28:45 <dsc_> So ill create this new CCS, you can all determine viability of my plan, and we can discuss it next week I suppose :P
17:29:16 <rehrar> sounds good
17:29:17 <rehrar> make it so
17:29:19 <xmrscott[m]> Also in theory w/ dsc et al kind of providing a more separated logic + GUI app, it makes easier for folk to build other wallet implementations, etc
17:29:56 <dsc_> Yes, the application will have the option to act as a websocket server
17:30:04 <dsc_> so that's one way to interface with my wallet
17:30:11 <rehrar> Ok. In regards to workgroup updates. Rather than call them out one by one and wait for a response. Let's just put a small open time here where, if you are involved in a workgroup and would like to make a report, please speak up.
17:30:19 <msvb-lab> And a website or NodeJS server, good idea dsc.
17:30:22 <dsc_> and otherwise you can create a seperate QML app
17:30:35 <dsc_> msvb-lab: exactly
17:30:58 <dsc_> albeit custodial, so such thing would be more fit for personal use
17:31:27 <dsc_> "I want to interface with a wallet with python" -> will I use Monero RPC+zmg? Or will I use Feather's WS server?
17:31:54 <dsc_> (Qt is more than just a GUI framework, it's an eventloop with support for all kinds of protocols)
17:32:29 <dsc_> s/zmg/zmq/
17:32:29 <monerobux> dsc_ meant to say: "I want to interface with a wallet with python" -> will I use Monero RPC+zmq? Or will I use Feather's WS server?
17:32:42 <rehrar> alright, for the sake of time we need to move on
17:32:50 <rehrar> sorry. This discussion can continue after the meeting.
17:32:59 <msvb-lab> That's why it would be nice to have the chance to install your software in components, some of us just want WS without widgets.
17:33:17 <rehrar> Any workgroup with something to report? If not we'll move forward.
17:33:21 <dsc_> msvb-lab: Yeah it's a CLI/WS/QtWidgets in one, and possibly also QML
17:34:01 <rehrar> msvb-lab: It's your time to shine. Tell us about Grayhat.
17:34:10 <msvb-lab> Thanks rehrar.
17:34:30 <msvb-lab> We are invited to deliver Monero content under the name Monero Village, just like we do at Defcon.
17:35:02 <msvb-lab> This time the event is called Grayhat (https://grayhat.co/) and we have more or less total freedom in all decisions regarding our engagement.
17:35:37 <msvb-lab> Several other villages that are Defcon regulars are participating, like Biohacking, RedTeam, and IoT.
17:36:18 <msvb-lab> I don't have many details like if we receive rewards, but the event is in October and it is usually located in Texas but this time it is online only (like Defcon was.)
17:36:56 <msvb-lab> If at least three people (two beside me) pledge to deliver some kind of content, then I will send the organiser a village proposal for us. Similar to Defcon.
17:37:06 <rehrar> That online-only obviously drops costs considerably.
17:37:46 <msvb-lab> I'm pledging to connect our stagenet tippero (created by ajs and his colleague) to the Grayhat Discord server. And I'll do a speech probably, that's my content pledge.
17:38:09 <msvb-lab> Are there any questions about this, or general feelings?
17:38:15 <rehrar> What is the usual attendance of grayhat? Do we know?
17:38:56 <msvb-lab> I have not researched very much, but it was called something else before (in case you search on Facebook, Reddit, Twitter and those kinds of places.)
17:39:00 <msvb-lab> Let me find the old name...
17:39:02 <rehrar> I'm going to do something a bit new and ask the community whether they think this is a good use of my time (i.e. GF money).
17:39:50 <xmrscott[m]> If memory serves, DEF CON usually has like 30K, I think when it went digital it dropped to like 6K oddly
17:40:05 <rehrar> xmrscott[m]: I don't find this surprising.
17:40:10 <msvb-lab> Texas Cyber Summit was the name before they changed it to Grayhat.
17:40:10 <msvb-lab> https://www.texascybersummit.org/
17:40:17 <xmrscott[m]> So perhaps expect 1/5 of whatever it was last year?
17:40:27 <rehrar> People are pretty done with Zoom this and zoom that. Online everything.
17:40:41 <rehrar> I wouldn't pay for an online conference. Just my opinion.
17:41:22 <ArticMine> I would be very interested to see what happens with travel
17:41:38 <ArticMine> This will have an impact
17:41:45 <msvb-lab> dsc Would it be an interesting use of your time to write a tutorial about your new planned QML work and answer questions about it during Grayhat (IRC or Discord)?
17:42:04 <msvb-lab> We could put that in the monerovillage.org as being a part of our engagement in Grayhat for example.
17:42:43 <msvb-lab> The problem is that they select villages on Friday, so it's kind of urgent that we get at least three pledges during this meeting or today sometime.
17:42:59 <rehrar> meh, sure. I'm in.
17:43:08 <ArticMine> For a talk yes
17:43:13 <rehrar> and that's three
17:43:17 <dsc_> msvb-lab: What kind of tutorial? Would this be a talk, over chat?
17:43:34 <msvb-lab> If you like the idea to speak over video, then dsc you could report your progress that way.
17:43:50 <msvb-lab> Or do it in writing, the conference attendees read it and ask questions over IRC or Discord.
17:44:14 <ArticMine> That is interesting
17:44:14 <msvb-lab> It's your choice. I personally hate video, but most people find it the most relevant and enjoyable way to report development.
17:44:18 <dsc_> I'm doing some pretty sick hours last few months so I'm not rly fit for voice/video
17:44:23 <dsc_> lol
17:44:42 <msvb-lab> Okay, we have rehrar, ArticMine, and me so I will propose us as the Monero Village.
17:44:55 <rehrar> yes. When do we need to have content schedule to them by?
17:45:05 <dsc_> Cool, but let me know. I can help out when necessary
17:45:18 <ArticMine> Can we add more speakers
17:46:00 <msvb-lab> rehrar: We decide everything more or less. I don't know of a single deadline. They will probably change their website schedule every time a request from us comes in to do so.
17:46:12 <msvb-lab> Thanks dsc, then you are staff like us other three.
17:46:15 <msvb-lab> Before we leave the topic rehrar, does anybody know the new Monero Community official replacement for Taiga? We have a new project management system in our getmonero.org domain right?
17:46:41 <msvb-lab> I only read about one thousand lines of text regarding the recent massive changes, so I'm totally lost about systems and control flow.
17:46:58 <rehrar> we do not have a new project management system to my knowledge, no
17:46:58 <msvb-lab> I assume there were more than five thousand lines regarding the changes.
17:47:15 <rehrar> you can still use Taiga if you want
17:47:23 <msvb-lab> Okay, I'll collect any information I get about this in Taiga then.
17:47:27 <rehrar> sounds good
17:47:33 <msvb-lab> Thanks rehrar, if there are no questions then it's time for the next topic.
17:48:00 <rehrar> Open Ideas Time is next
17:48:07 <xmrscott[m]> msvb-lab: If you're looking at new project management tools, suggest pinging sgp as he's exploring some
17:48:20 <rehrar> If anyone has something not on the agenda to discuss, please feel free to bring it up here.
17:48:31 <rehrar> or just an idea you'd like to share with the community
17:48:53 <rehrar> we'll let it sit for a few minutes, and if nothing comes up, we can end. :)
17:49:28 <sgp_> Interviews with Samourai and Wasabi coming out very soon
17:49:51 <rehrar> sgp_: for....Monero Talk or?
17:50:00 <sgp_> Monero Space YT
17:50:44 <msvb-lab> Are Monero Coffeechat, Monero Space, and Monero Talk similar?
17:51:27 <msvb-lab> Or any of those no longer broadcasting? Maybe it is a name change.
17:51:27 <rehrar> Monero Talk is run by other people Monero Space is a new workgroup.
17:51:40 <rehrar> Coffee Chat is in hiatus right now probably for the future.
17:51:52 <rehrar> But ok, we can go ahead and call it here. :) Next meeting in two weeks.
17:52:59 <lh1008[m]> I have a question.
17:53:17 <rehrar> sure. What's up?
17:53:54 <kinghat[m]> dsc_: wallet i2p spport? selsta socks5 for i2p support?
17:54:00 <lh1008[m]> What do I need to do for the proposal merging?
17:54:23 <rehrar> I'll talk with luigi
17:54:34 <rehrar> feedback seemed neutral to positive, so I think we can move forward. People can speak up if they disagree.
17:54:35 <selsta> kinghat[m]: socks5 support so that you can use e.g. tor to connect to a remote node, price sources and update checks
17:54:44 <lh1008[m]> Okay rehrar. Cool. Thanks :)
17:54:52 <selsta> not sure about i2p, guess it should work too but a remote i2p node is required?
17:55:02 <dsc_> kinghat[m]: no
17:55:11 <lh1008[m]> If anyone has any questions please do.
17:55:11 <dsc_> unfortunately not
17:55:51 <selsta> but no direct i2p-zero integration
17:56:13 <kinghat[m]> selsta: do you know if the fix for for i2p nodes will be in the fall fork?
17:56:43 <kinghat[m]> knaccc might know
17:56:56 <kinghat[m]> seed node* fix
17:57:33 <msvb-lab> dsc ArticMine rehrar: Should we plan on having one Grayhat event next week then one more in September, and two in October. Is that sensible?
17:58:51 <rehrar> by event you mean a meeting for us?
17:59:37 <msvb-lab> Yes, in order to decide things like how to broadcast video and assign roles.
18:00:28 <msvb-lab> So we are not forced to check IRC all the time for questions, and can try to collect them all on one day (the raison detre for meetings in the first place.)
18:01:15 <ArticMine> Yes
18:01:16 <dsc_> So what does this mean msvb-lab ? I can talk about the wallet for a hour or so, or about the official GUI, no problem
18:01:32 <dsc_> but the whole orga etc. might be too much for me, I am *very* busy
18:01:39 <dsc_> :P
18:02:45 <dsc_> Very Important Coding Things (tm)(c)
18:03:15 <msvb-lab> dsc: You can be a speaker, that's fine and don't need to attend any meetings. However you will need to seek information about how to deliver the content (Twitch or whatever) as well as communicate the topic so we can put it on a schedule.
18:03:34 <dsc_> When is this event?
18:03:39 <dsc_> Wallet is releasing in December
18:03:42 <dsc_> might be best to do PR after that
18:03:50 <msvb-lab> If you decide to miss a meeting like this one, then find the people who attended and exchange information with them. Or do so directly in our project management: https://taiga.getmonero.org/project/michael-grayhat/kanban/
18:03:52 <dsc_> churn mode atm
18:04:12 <selsta> kinghat[m]: no, don't think this is fixed yet
18:06:20 <msvb-lab> I think it's wise to have a thumbnail image (find it in the menu at https://grayhat.co/) that is over 10 Mo large. That gives your event a high quality.
18:13:00 <msvb-lab> ArticMine Do you have a Taiga username, so that I can put you on the project?
19:14:54 <msvb-lab> ArticMine: You asked about inviting other speakers to Grayhat. Would you like to find our friend intj440 and invite him to propose a speech?
19:15:01 <msvb-lab> I'm asking because I think you are in similar timezones.
21:04:47 <msvb-lab> xmrscott[m]: Do you know how to use epics? If nobody wants to organise our Grayhat event epics, I'll just delete the epics module.
21:05:21 <msvb-lab> https://taiga.getmonero.org/project/michael-grayhat/kanban/
21:05:22 <msvb-lab> https://taiga.getmonero.org/project/michael-grayhat/epics/
22:22:15 <msvb-lab> needmoney90: Is your recent village challenge published online, so that we can try to use it in the Grayhat event?
22:44:03 <needmoney90> https://gist.github.com/livinginformation/6210a620d257a6cddfca34bb24ee4856
23:36:48 <msvb-lab> I see it needmoney90, thanks.
23:57:57 <kinghat[m]> https://youtu.be/JEP3Kpnfzx0?t=1548