01:06:13 <gingeropolous> ok lets not fork for 4 years. will we be decentralizede then
01:48:09 <sgp_> jwinterm: hmm, want to take another stab at an image that conveys the message I intended? It will be good to nail that down
01:54:10 <gingeropolous> eh, i like the real potential.
01:55:00 <gingeropolous> its a subtle nod to the fact that monero's still in development, and that theres actually a real potential that monero is the magic internet money ppl think the corn is
01:55:22 <gingeropolous> or it has a real potential to change the world
01:57:45 <jwinterm> mebbe
04:13:12 <sgp_> Still I'd like to see another take
04:14:02 <sgp_> Maybe "Monero has REAL privacy" is enough
05:33:08 <kinghat[m]> mebbe posted already https://www.forbes.com/sites/shehanchandrasekera/2020/07/06/irs-is-trying-to-deanonymize-privacy-coins-like-monero-and-zcash
06:29:27 <xmrscott[m]> <rehrar "how do you get the point where y"> I mean, honestly, heavy bags really given money is involved. If this was politics or worldview one might argue willful delusion via a combination of Id in hero worship or something... that is the refusal to acknowledge something is imperfect because you place your Id in it and to acknowledge it would somehow be a blow to your Id
06:38:30 <xmrscott[m]> OpenSSL was created circa 1998, but just because it was around for for almost 20 years does't grant it immunity to say, Heartbleed. Was heartbleed terrible? Yes. But you acknowledge it, patch it and move on. Denying it exists serves no purpose. Perhaps there's some parallel in CC tribalism/maxi's akin to psychology in dealing w/ people in denial in mid/advanced alcoholism
06:39:46 <xmrscott[m]> In other words treat BTC maxis like you would treat an alcoholic, IDK
06:45:15 <rehrar> xmrscott[m]: one reason why I don't own much Monero. It keeps me honest.
06:49:29 <xmrscott[m]> Yep, I think it's one of the great things about the community. Justin is involved in Zcash related protcols, Sarae gave a closer on don't be a tribalist basically at the end of Konferenco, etc. We're inevitably going go have some bias, but hopefully it's relatively small enough to be inconsequential to seeing things as they are
06:49:55 <xmrscott[m]>  * Yep, I think it's one of the great things about the community. Justin is involved in Zcash related protcols, Sarae gave a closer on don't be a tribalist basically at the end of Konferenco, etc. We're inevitably going to have some bias, but hopefully it's relatively small enough to be inconsequential to seeing things as they are
12:47:38 <sgp_> Please let's not nuke the Facebook if anyone was thinking of that. It's important to meet people where they are. We should find more moderators for it if needed though
12:50:43 <fort3hlulz> Is there much engagement there?
12:50:48 <fort3hlulz> I nuked my FB account long ago
12:51:17 <fort3hlulz> I'm kind of bummed I can't get more community support for the Discord, but I guess thats to be expected for privacy-conscious users. Its just such a common on-ramp for newbies in the space.
12:54:02 <dsc_> not necessarily, it may also look bad/ironic to newcomers
12:55:07 <fort3hlulz> I doubt that for most who aren't heavily down the rabbit hole of privacy
12:55:32 <fort3hlulz> I certainly understand the sentiment, but its a big loss in onboarding IMO
12:56:02 <fort3hlulz> No one I know uses (or has heard of) IRC outside of my infosec coworkers
12:56:23 <dsc_> I'm certain I can't convince ya'll here but at least I voiced my opinion
12:56:52 * dsc_ flies away into the distance
12:56:57 <fort3hlulz> I mean there isn't much activity in the Discord, but not sure if thats because its never been pushed/shared
12:57:02 <fort3hlulz> Or if its because no one wants to use it
12:57:07 <fort3hlulz> If the latter I'm happy with that
12:58:17 <fort3hlulz> Would rather we moved to a better, more modern alternative for the majority of discussion like Keybase or Matrix
13:09:23 <sgp_> fort3hlulz: in my opinion there's a whole other set of users who are interested in using Discord. More similar to the Telegram users than the IRC users
13:10:04 <sgp_> We just have been turning them off until this point since we're using tools that they don't ever use
13:10:32 <sgp_> I only joined the community IRC channels initially because someone relayed them to Slack, then I found out about Riot
13:18:15 <fort3hlulz> Yeah exactly
13:18:22 <fort3hlulz> Discord serves a totally different userbase
13:59:05 <ErCiccione[m]> At the end anybody can fire up a discord and discuss monero stuff, no? What's the blocker?
14:03:37 <fort3hlulz> There is a discord, but not much activity, and no one that I recognize from the community is active on there
14:03:54 <fort3hlulz> Apparently it was recently overhauled but not sure by who and with no announcement via any official channels
14:05:06 <bemore> Discord is the largest platform for discussing cryptocurrency in the US, telegramm is the largest non-US chatting platform
14:05:51 <bemore> (unbased claims but I'm pretty sure they're true)
14:05:56 <dsc_> bitcoin is the largest cryptocurrency by txs
14:10:54 <bemore> in my opinion, it would be worth expanding the Monero Discord.. most channels on Discord are particularly unethical. Pump groups are common and users move from one scamcoin to the next
14:12:33 <bemore> a large number of Discord users are teenagers, I believe. It's something to consider, many pump groups are likely run by teenagers
14:18:44 <ErCiccione[m]> If that's the case than you only need reputable community members willing to deal with loads of teens on discord mostly interested to pump and dump. Good luck with that (maybe that's the reason why known folks are not interested in discord)
14:22:03 <bemore> what I've been hoping to see from monero is some kind of catch for students
14:22:38 <bemore> if someone tried to help, they're often pointed to github issues and that's.. hard on an experienced programmer
14:22:48 <bemore> so that helpful person ends up somewhere else
14:24:02 <bemore> discord would be a good home for that kind of workgroup
14:28:40 <ErCiccione[m]>  i rarely see people being pointed to github issues if they want to help. Usually they are suggested to contact a workgroup on irc, matrix etc. I agree more and diverse points of contact are good, but the problem remains: who is going to deal with that? Moderation requires time and efforts. The only thing needed is somebody to step up and start doing it, otherwise we can speak for days about how this or that
14:28:40 <ErCiccione[m]> other tools would be good to have.
14:33:01 <bemore> it's not that much effort, discord has partially working methods to block bot accounts
14:33:33 <bemore> could bridge it to a new IRC channel and if just a few monero folk joined it, there would be more answers than questions
14:34:03 <bemore> I guess it's not that unreasonable, might as well try it
14:34:20 <bemore> #monero-learn is available
14:36:25 <bemore> if I see a couple joins, I'll set up a discord bridge
14:46:35 <bemore> "-ChanServ(ChanServ@services.)- The #monero namespace is managed by the monero project."
14:48:02 <bemore> yeah I don't know how freenode works, but looks like #monero-learn is usable if others agree
15:12:37 <sgp_> relaying that music chat both ways might be a good start?
15:12:55 <sgp_> I didn't realize the freenode chats are only one way
15:13:22 <sgp_> anything that's collaborative is good
15:14:25 <sgp_> the Discord pools category can probably be cut down to one channel
15:15:48 <sgp_> some trading game would go over well I think, where users could bet or something. could pair well with r/xmrtrader
15:16:18 <asymptotically> there's a trading game in #bitcoin-pricetalk we can steal :)
15:16:27 <sgp_> how does it work?
15:17:34 <asymptotically> not sure to be honest, i just see people playing with it every now and again. i think that people bet on the bitcoin price
15:18:54 <asymptotically> SatoshiBot, if you want to play around with it
15:20:38 <sgp_> this is a project that osrsneedf2p would be crazy enough to undertake
15:21:22 <sgp_> people really like games. minko blew up the transaction count when it came out haha
15:22:02 <bemore> who's able to host them, though? they're not really legal in the states
15:22:47 <sgp_> no clue
15:22:56 <lza_menace> i would
15:23:16 <sgp_> trading game is one game. what's another game idea?
15:26:19 <lza_menace> for web projects?
15:26:37 <lza_menace> spades, poker, blackjack
15:26:49 <sgp_> mostly for Discord, meant to encourage participation
15:27:01 <sgp_> we can come up with a bunch of trivia questions and spit one out at random
15:27:08 <asymptotically> .trivia
15:27:08 <monerobux> This question is in the field of Entertainment: Video Games and is of medium difficulty: Toby Fox&#039;s &quot;Megalovania&quot; was first used where?
15:27:18 <monerobux> If you said Radiation&#039;s Earthbound Halloween Hack you are correct, but if you said Homestuck: [S] Wake, Undertale, or Mother: Cognitive Dissonance you should call your parents and complain.
15:27:34 <sgp_> Monero trivia though
15:27:47 <asymptotically> yeah i think the monerobux one is broken too :( he's meant to give you 4 options
15:35:57 <lza_menace> have you guys seen the SSO system recently created for wow?
15:36:23 <dsc_> .seen sso
15:36:23 <monerobux> Sorry, I haven't seen sso around.
15:36:47 <lza_menace> that would be kind of cool in the monero ecosystem as well. community people have the option to setup an account on one platform managed by core team
15:37:02 <lza_menace> then others can build apps that tie into that authentication system
15:40:38 <dsc_> lza_menace: asymptotically is trying to code "authenticate with wownero/monero priv8 key" functionality
15:40:44 <hyc> an authentication system eh. should use a monero address and openalias
15:41:15 <dsc_> hyc: yeah, we're trying to modify RedHat's Keycloak atm
15:41:32 <hyc> cool
15:41:53 <hyc> what do you want to be able to login to with this SSO system?
15:42:04 <hyc>  ... Symas has built a couple different SSO systems over the years
15:42:06 <lza_menace> forum, ccs, gitea
15:42:09 <jwinterm> the matrix
15:42:20 <dsc_> hyc: we (Wownero) use it for forum/ccs/gitea
15:42:36 <lza_menace> I want to build some web apps and tie it into that auth as well
15:42:54 <dsc_> hyc: keycloak is nice SSO software, you should try it. I've had worse in past (CAS)
15:42:57 <hyc> easiet is just to use Kerberos
15:43:08 <dsc_> in the past*
15:43:43 <hyc> can never avoid needing to pass session cookies in a web app. so annoying.
15:44:15 <dsc_> hyc: Yes, but the web app does not need to validate against SSO, it can validate locally when it has the pubkey of SSO
15:44:38 <dsc_> Err, that came out confusing. Yeah, you'll have a session cookie.
15:45:00 <hyc> sure. but kerberos already lends itself well to that style of interaction
15:45:47 <dsc_> Is Kerberos much different from OpenID Connect / OAuth2?
15:45:55 <dsc_> I don't have experiecne with it :D
15:46:27 <hyc> kerberos prcedes them by a couple decades. it is often running in the backend of systems like that
15:48:05 <hyc> it's also the basis of windows authentication. M$ uses it for their own seamless SSO fro internet explorer
15:49:26 <fort3hlulz> https://twitter.com/aantonop/status/1280520965684944897?s=20
15:49:27 <hyc> back in 2003 or so I wrote an apache module to support it as well.
15:49:36 <fort3hlulz> More intellectual honesty from the "core" bitcoiners :)
15:49:53 <fort3hlulz> tl;dr - Bitcoin wont ever have Monero-like privacy
15:50:06 <hyc> lol
15:50:31 <sgp_> fort3hlulz: is that what Andreas said or is that your analysis?
15:50:34 <dsc_> hyc: Heh' interesting. At my previous employer we did similar authentication related things with lua inside nginx-plus
15:50:39 <fort3hlulz> Thats what he said
15:50:43 <fort3hlulz> its a 1.5m vid
15:50:46 <fort3hlulz> Well worth the watch
15:51:09 <fort3hlulz> He made a unique post/video on the question of if Bitcoin would ever have Monero-like privacy
15:51:18 <hyc> great reply https://twitter.com/mezie16/status/1280525920764395525 in crypto, 99% of the time, "zero knowledge" describes the person saying it
15:51:29 <fort3hlulz> Saw that lol
15:52:24 <sgp_> hyc: LMAO
15:52:46 <sgp_> annoying that he mentioned the regulated exchanges comment. It's a naive way to look at compliance
15:53:06 <fort3hlulz> We need that regulation framework....
15:53:14 <sgp_> fort3hlulz: can you share this link on Reddit?
15:53:18 <fort3hlulz> yes
15:54:10 <hyc> 1:46 video and the last 20 seconds are just "please subscribe!" nonsense
15:54:29 <dsc_> nice video =)
15:54:43 <hyc> yeah, overall a clear message
15:54:56 <sgp_> yeah it's quite clear overall which is super good
15:55:02 <sgp_> it' taken a while to get here
15:55:04 <hyc> but "bitcoin is not a privacy coin" means "bitcoin is not a currency"
15:55:29 <sgp_> even in August he was sorta in the "hopefully CT will be a thing" camp
15:55:30 <hyc> they still have a way to go ...
15:56:18 <fort3hlulz> https://www.reddit.com/r/Monero/comments/hmx6qe/andreas_antonopoulos_on_why_bitcoin_likely_wont/
15:56:19 <monerobux> [REDDIT] Andreas Antonopoulos on why Bitcoin likely won't ever have privacy similar to Monero (https://twitter.com/aantonop/status/1280520965684944897?s=20) to r/Monero | 1 points (100.0%) | 0 comments | Posted by fort3hlulz | Created at 2020-07-07 - 15:56:13
15:59:06 <sgp_> ty
15:59:13 <sgp_> worth a Blockfolio push?
15:59:46 <fort3hlulz> Hmmm
16:00:02 <fort3hlulz> Since it's not clearly advising Monero usage, and is more focused on Bitcoin I'm not sure
16:07:31 <sarang> Oof, "zero-knowledge proof"... proving systems are not transaction protocols :/
16:07:39 <sarang> I get the intent of the tweet
16:09:10 <dEBRUYNE> hyc: ring signatures are also zero-knowledge afaik
16:09:28 <sarang> not necessarily
16:09:57 <sarang> You can build ring signature constructions out of certain kinds of zkp systems, but also can build them with other witness-indistinguishable building blocks
16:10:10 <sarang> Ring signatures are also not a transaction protocol :)
16:10:39 <niocbrrrrrr> it has been proved that I have zero knowledge,
16:10:42 <niocbrrrrrr> I have absolute anonymity \o/
16:11:18 <sarang> I really wish the common terminology wasn't "ring signature == limited anonymity, zkp == full anonymity"
16:11:29 <fort3hlulz> no kidding lol
16:11:43 <sarang> They're both types of building blocks that can be used in transaction protocols with different properties
16:17:49 <xmrscott[m]> <fort3hlulz "Would rather we moved to a bette"> Keybase should be avoided like the plague. They got bought by Zoom who has not only deleted US based Hong Kong activists at China's request
16:18:32 <xmrscott[m]> But also given data to China on users which is suggestive of them giving data to USA as well
16:19:51 <xmrscott[m]> Zoom also for a time basically pulled a Zooko and said all free chats would be listened on as part of a collab w/ US LE
16:21:02 <fort3hlulz> Oh damn forgot about that...
16:21:15 <xmrscott[m]> If you want a 1:1 type chat app I would recommend GNU Jami, have used it for a couple of months w/o issue w/ family
16:21:35 <fort3hlulz> Ive moved my whole family/friends to signal over the last 6m
16:23:15 <sgp_> Jami looks cool
16:23:22 <dsc_> xmrscott[m]: have you tried toxchat?
16:23:32 <dsc_> i liked it
16:23:49 <dsc_> albeit the UI is very basic
16:23:55 <sgp_> I used Toxchat before I knew about Monero 😎
16:24:04 <dsc_> ooh, the real hipster! :D
16:24:15 <sarang> Ah, Signal... surely the best way to support private communication is to give out your phone number :/
16:24:20 <sarang> sigh
16:24:38 <sarang> I love the idea of Signal; I hate the way they went about the implementation
16:24:39 <fort3hlulz> its far better than anything else I could get normies on
16:24:46 <fort3hlulz> And theyre going to phase out phone number
16:24:49 <sarang> Yeah, it certainly has the convenience factor in its favor
16:24:50 <fort3hlulz> but yes thats a huge drawback
16:28:27 <xmrscott[m]> dsc_: Yes, I tried either it or a client w/ the protocol I want to say 2.5ish years ago, community seemed dead at the time so I looked elsewhere
16:29:27 <xmrscott[m]> Like there was still very basic functionality missing at the time
16:33:15 -xmr-pr- [meta] SarangNoether opened issue #482: Research meeting: 8 July 2020 @ 17:00 UTC
16:33:16 -xmr-pr- > https://github.com/monero-project/meta/issues/482
16:35:41 <Mumuks[m]> <sarang "I love the idea of Signal; I hat"> Signal was even offered to federate their servers, someone had implemented the code for federation, and the Signal guy refused
16:36:10 <sarang> Why?
16:36:17 <sarang> Did they specify?
16:36:59 <Mumuks[m]> I don't remember exactly, at the time to me it sounded like excuses
16:38:04 <xmrscott[m]> Yep, they also at least a year ago refused to provide ARM binaries, which is why I started trying to get people to use Jami
16:40:05 <xmrscott[m]> Because Signal would then be nigh unusable when Linux phones came out this year, and I wanted encrypted texts and calls with friends when I make the jump via the postmarketOS CE PinePhone release this/next month
16:43:13 <kinghat[m]> signal is moving away from the phone number being tied to accounts fwiw
16:49:29 <xmrscott[m]> Re: Discord, I believe the one that is currently bridged is 'official' right? Any reason why it can't be added here:  https://web.getmonero.org/community/hangouts/
16:50:14 <xmrscott[m]> For the purposes of easing bringing people into the community
16:53:16 <xmrscott[m]> Since that is a valid point, whoever raised it
16:55:31 <sgp_> it should be added
17:01:28 <xmrscott[m]> Alright, if no one else does, I'll add a PR by sometime late tonigbt
17:01:56 <sgp_> Can we allow people with high rep on the Discord server to send messages to here from Discord?
17:02:29 <asymptotically> is this derpy_bridge_?
17:02:42 <xmrscott[m]> Yes
17:04:51 <xmrscott[m]> It looks like only publicly visible roles are pool ops and bots (and generic members)
17:05:27 <sgp_> Can we "rank up" users for completing a quiz about Monero?
17:05:33 <xmrscott[m]> Probably create another role that allows text send access on ORC channels
17:05:48 <xmrscott[m]> Via talking to one of said bots, etc
17:05:59 <sgp_> Pass the quiz, then you can post
17:06:08 <xmrscott[m]> Already done
17:06:22 <xmrscott[m]> Explained in changelog it looks like
17:06:32 <xmrscott[m]> See:
17:06:43 <xmrscott[m]> due to spambots if you wanna communicate with the bridges over the category IRC-RELAYS, you now have to type -role bridges in any text channel, it will unlock the permissions to write over there
17:07:01 <fort3hlulz> Who owns the server?
17:07:05 <fort3hlulz> Do any of you have admin on there?
17:07:36 <xmrscott[m]> (Also in welcome-info)
17:07:48 <fort3hlulz> And can someone link me? Lost the Discord server somehow and cant find the URL lol
17:08:05 <xmrscott[m]> Rehrar and nm90 technically own, admin'd by a Kayla
17:08:07 <derpy_bridge_> <[discord] sgp#7572>: Test
17:08:21 <asymptotically> i'm not a fan of the bridges (unless they work like the matrix ones) because irc mods only have the option to mute/ban the whole bridge and not someone on the other end
17:08:34 <xmrscott[m]> fort3hlulz: https://discord.gg/KstUYzW
17:09:03 <sgp_> asymptotically: ideally mods can be given permissions over their relevelant channels
17:09:15 <fort3hlulz> Thanks
17:09:34 <xmrscott[m]> asymptotically: anecdotally, has there been any issue w/ Discord bridge since April
17:09:41 <fort3hlulz> I'm happy to help out modding there, as I use Discord for other CC projects and so am normally on there pretty regularly
17:09:41 <bemore> bridges are faily safe to use, trolling isn't common in my experience
17:10:02 <xmrscott[m]> But yes, also what sgp said should suffice, hopefully
17:10:07 <asymptotically> not sure about since april specifically but i think the bridge has been k-lined at least once due to spam
17:10:48 <derpy_bridge_> <[discord] GoodEnough#2932>: test test
17:10:53 <fort3hlulz> Nice
17:11:04 <asymptotically> test failed
17:11:04 <monerobux> Test failed
17:11:19 <fort3hlulz> lol
17:11:36 <fort3hlulz> If there are individual users abusing the bridge we can ban them in Discord
17:11:46 <fort3hlulz> Instead of kicking the bridge like has been done recently lol
17:11:56 <fort3hlulz> s/we/admins
17:11:56 <monerobux> fort3hlulz meant to say: If there are individual users abusing the bridge admins can ban them in Discord
17:13:18 <derpy_bridge_> <[discord] bemore#3657>: \wave
17:13:30 <bemore> \wave
17:34:53 <rehrar> fort3hlulz: I'm happy to have you help mod discord if you want.
17:37:45 <fort3hlulz> Id love to jump in
19:07:54 <rehrar> LOVE
19:24:28 <xmrmatterbridge> <xmrhaelan> Is #monero-compliance matterbridge still down?
19:24:44 <sgp_> looks like it
19:25:09 <xmrmatterbridge> <xmrhaelan> How to get back up?
19:40:08 <sgp_> rehrar? idk who does it
19:41:22 <rehrar> Is the bridge down as a whole?
19:41:32 <rehrar> Well obviously not.
19:41:41 <rehrar> Cuz xmrhaelan is talking through it.
19:41:49 <rehrar> When did it go down?
19:44:29 <sgp_> April 7?
19:48:15 <xmrmatterbridge> <xmrhaelan> I just haven’t seen anything on #monero-compliance in awhile
20:03:42 <needmoney90> > not sure about since april specifically but i think the bridge has been k-lined at least once due to spam
20:03:55 <needmoney90> asymptotically to be fair, freenode itself also experiences spam attacks that they cannot handle
20:04:13 <needmoney90> there are days where a user logs in, spams three offensive messages, leaves, and then pops onto a new account and repeats
20:04:54 <needmoney90> spam is a general issue with chat platforms as a whole, it is not an issue with any particular relay. Being able to enforce the spam over the relay is important, though. Generally if theres a relay, the room's mods should have mod privs over the relay so they can deal with spam as it happens.
20:05:14 <needmoney90> The benefits of relays far outweigh their costs imo
20:05:49 <needmoney90> You might find it hard to believe, but newbies dont think IRC is the flashiest thing ever, and are usually pretty hesitant to use it.
20:06:01 <needmoney90> Which is a shame
20:06:45 <needmoney90> IRC being push-only with no ability to retroactively enforce, the 'spam issue' is really an IRC issue
20:07:59 <needmoney90> sgp_ perhaps we should have an initiative to somehow get relay statuses
20:08:01 <needmoney90> idk how we'd do it
20:08:07 <needmoney90> but a page saying whats up/down would be neat
20:08:17 <hyc> eh? you just said spam happens on all chat platforms, why is it an IRC issue?
20:08:31 <rehrar> Ok. Is it good now?
20:11:29 <needmoney90> Hyc IRC is push only
20:11:36 <needmoney90> You can't delete spam as a mod
20:11:43 <needmoney90> Only remove users after the fact
20:12:08 <needmoney90> It's one of the only chat platforms I can think of where that's the case, actually
20:13:56 <needmoney90> The telegram relay had to be removed, for example, because despite fantastic automated enforcement of spam half a second after it comes up, it still passed through the relay, and IRC's design made that horrendous for the people on the other end
20:20:37 <xmrmatterbridge> <cankerwort> https://ia801504.us.archive.org/34/items/dark-web-files-from-blueleaks/200309%20LES%20FBI%20EIR%20-%20Darknet%20Market%20Actors%20Likely%20Convert%20Illicit%20Bitcoin%20to%20Monero%20Using%20MorphToken%20Cryptocurrency%20Exchange%2C%20Impeding%20Law%20Enforcement%20Tracing%20Efforts.pdf
20:22:27 <fort3hlulz> Hey rehrar, revuo says that CLI v0.26.0.1 is out :P Might wanna fix the typo before people think they're way behind haha
20:23:09 <fort3hlulz> Ah, looks like hyc reported the same in Reddit. Sorry for the double report :)
20:50:58 <sgp_> cankerwort: note that this doesn't really reflect negatively of Monero. The report very clearly is about an entity the US government seems to think is a VASP
21:22:30 <xmrmatterbridge> <cankerwort> @sgp I agree, although it makes me think that KYC-free instant exchanges will end up a sort of hydra like the DNMs themselves
21:27:04 <sgp_> Is that not expected by many?
22:04:18 <xmrmatterbridge> <cankerwort> Yes I suppose so. Also an interesting example of how the messaging of "monero is better than a mixer" alone can lead to BTC being tainted.
22:48:10 <derpy_bridge_> <[discord] Kayla#5718>: https://blog.chainalysis.com/reports/plustoken-scam-bitcoin-price
22:48:26 <derpy_bridge_> <[discord] Kayla#5718>: mixers dont work, is just a myth 😛
22:49:53 <derpy_bridge_> <[discord] Kayla#5718>: "The scammers have transferred the Bitcoin more than 24,000 times, using more than 71,000 different addresses — and that’s not even counting cash outs or transfers to off-ramps such as exchanges. "
22:51:17 <derpy_bridge_> <[discord] Kayla#5718>: still the funds were able to get tracked down and those analysis algo getting better by the minute